Dual Citizenship: Balancing Earthly and Heavenly Responsibilities

You're listening to The Bible Guys, a podcast where a couple of friends talk

about the Bible in fun in practical ways. Good Morning, morning, good

morning, good morning. You've done that at least one time a week,

a week for it feels like forever. It's three weeks. Yeah, I

know, that's so funny. Hey, keeping a promise. Good morning,

It's it's Monday. If you're tuning in live, not live, but what

real time, real time. I guess if you're tuning in on Monday,

it's Monday morning. If it's if it's Monday morning for you, good morning

on Monday, thanks, Jeff. I mean if you're like, if you're

keeping up with the current releasing, I'll say it. If you're up to

date, up to date, I guess yes. Well, anyway, if

you're listening on the day this was released, Yeah, that's what you're trying

to do. That's what I try to say. Okay, Okay, So

Chris, that was a lot Tougher name is Chris. This is Jeff Forrester,

and we are the Bible Guys. There we go. So we love

or dad joke competitions, yes, sure, and as Maveratt, we love

them so much that one of our listeners came and they left this dad jokes

calendar on our desks, right, which is going too Yes, very nice.

Yeah, it was used as good as mine. I have not looked

through all of the pages of the case. This one is three hundred and

sixty five days of unbelievable jokes. That's what it says. Yes, my

favorite one February six says dad, are we pyromaniacs? Yes we are?

Son? Oh wow wow, yes we are. So that's great. Anyways,

well, today Desiree has put together our dad jokes. Okay, here

they are and we're going to read five each. I got the first one.

Here goes. I don't trust stairs. They're always up to something.

Okay, okay. My wife keeps asking me why I have so much candy.

She doesn't know that I always keep a few twigs up my sleeve.

Oh my goodness, I get a few twigs. Yeah that's speech impediments.

No, I'm I'm imitatingly, I'm joking. All right, Here we go,

truly, whoa wah one. I'm so good at sleeping that I can

do it with my eyes closed. Oh that's terrible, but it's true.

Yeah, it's sure. You never see any kids like sleeping with their eyes

partly open. Oh creepy, creepy. Yeah, okay. Uh. I

was asked if I could clear the table after dinner. I needed a running

start, but I made it. That's actually really good. That's a good

one. That's a good one. That's a good one. All right.

I used to hate facial hair, but then it grew on me. Okay,

that's okay, that's pretty good. Where do pirates get their books?

Where? Second hand stores? Yeah? That was rough. That's the roughest

one today. Okay, that's the rough rough one here. Yeah, all

right, here you go. We're like, we're trying to like it.

Here we go. I used to be able to play piano by ear,

but now I have to use my hands. Yeah. So, so I

knew a guy. He was famous, famous preacher. He was a Vietnam

vet. He was a Navy seal and he got hit by a white phosphorus

grenade. Shouldn't have lived, but he did. But he had really really

bad burns all over his body. And uh he uh, the fingers on

his right hand, the three you know, his ring finger, and those

three fingers were stuck. So he just had a pointer and then on the

other one he had two fingers that he could use and that was it.

But his hands had gotten and he lost his ear, one of his ears,

so he had a fake ear and he could play the piano. One

of his therapy things was to play the piano. So he'd play the piano

and he'd be sitting there playing like that. He goes, hey, did

you know play by ear? Every know? And he goes ding ding ding

ding ding ding ding, and he'd play it with his ear. He'd take

his ear, he take his ear off. Yes, Dave Reaver was his

name. So funny. Yeah, that's he's hysterically funny. And then all

the old ladies would pass out and yeah it was Yeah. I would have

probably told that story too, because when you hear the phrase piano by ear,

that would be hard to forget. Yeah, okay, here's the here's

the Oh no, you didn't tell your fourth one. My son was afraid

of jumping a hurdle, but eventually he got over it. Okay, Yeah,

I like to clear the table. One clear the table is great?

Yeah, that too similar. How about this one? Have you heard about

the new corduroy pillows? No, they're making headlines. That's pretty Yeah,

that's a good one. That is a good one. I'm currently reading an

anti gravity book. I just can't put it down. That's a good one.

It's clever. It's okay, it is clever. Clever, it is

clever. Yeah, well, okay, I give it a C minus.

Today, all right, should we go through the calendar? I mean we

used to try to redeem the day. Well, how about we just do

one from the calendar? Okay, it's like a bonus one. What do

you call one hundred? Baby sheep rolling down a hill? A lambslide?

Oh, that's pretty good, Okay, a lambslide. I was thinking when

you said one hundred, I thought, okay, is it called like,

you know, is this something with one hundred? You know, like a

legion or something that's I got hospitalized due to a peekaboo accident. They put

me in the ICU. Oh my goodness. That's a good one. Really,

that was a good one. Well, thank you to the person who

gave us these. They will it will make my day every day for the

next three hundred and sixty five. That's great. Well, hey, today

we are picking up in Matthew twenty two, Mark twelve, and Luke twenty

all three of these we're reading these because again we're in a series where we're

reading chronologically and also in parallel, and this story is recorded in all three

of these gospels. Yeah, okay, so Matthew Chapter twenty two, Verse

fifteen, it says, then the Pharisees met together to plot how to trap

Jesus into saying something for which he could be arrested. They sent some of

their disciples, along with the supporters of Herod to meet him. Teacher.

They said, we know how honest you are. You teach the way of

God truthfully, you are impartial and don't play favorites. Now tell us what

do you think about this? Is it right to pay taxes to Caesar or

not? But Jesus knew their evil motives, You hypocrites. He said,

why are you trying to trap me? Here? Show me the coin used

for the tax. And when they handed him a Roman coin, he asked,

whose pictures and title are stamped on it? Caesar's there, replied well.

Then he said, give to Caesar what belongs to Caesar, and give

to God what belongs to God. His reply amazed them, and they went

away. In Mark chapter twelve, verse thirteen, it says later the leaders

sent some pharisees and supporters of Herod to trap Jesus into saying something for which

he could be arrested. Teacher. They said, we know how honest you

are. You are impartial and don't play favorites. You teach the way of

God truthfully. Now tell us is it right to pay taxes to Caesar or

not? Should we pay them or shouldn't we? And Jesus saw through their

hypocrisy and said, why are you trying to trap me? Show me a

Roman coin and I'll tell you. When they'd handed it to him, he

asked, whose picture and title are stamped on it? Caesars. They replied,

well, then give to Caesar what belongs to Caesar, and give to

God what belongs to God. And his reply completely amazed them. And then

in Luke chapter twenty, it says, watching for their opportunity, the leader

sent spies pretending to be honest men. They tried to get Jesus to say

something that could be reported to the Roman governor so he could arrest Jesus teacher.

They said, we know that you speak and teach. What is right,

and are not influenced by what others think. You teach the way of

God truthfully. Now tell us is it right for us to pay taxes to

Caesar or not? And he saw through their trickery and said, show me

a Roman coin whose picture and title are stamped on it Caesar's. They replied,

well, then he said, give to Caesar what belongs to Caesar,

and give to God what belongs to God. So they failed to trap him

by what he said in front of the people. Instead, they were amazed

by his answer, and they became silent. Give to Caesar that which is

Caesar's. So we often say that we like the life application study Bible.

Yeah, and by the way, they don't. They don't even know that

we say that. Probably I don't think so. However, there is an

actual picture of the coin that was shown to g not the coin, but

an example. Say what, that's amazing, A how did they get that

coin right? Right? And shown to Jesus, And this is the coin

of Tiberius Caesar, who reigned from fourteen a d to thirty seven a D.

And anyway, but look at he's he's sort of like a I don't

mean this disrespectfully. He's got a really big nose, he's got big eyes.

I'm not sure if this is a actual perfect rendering of him, but

he was the Emperor. He would have made sure it's just right. Yeah.

Well he kind of looks kind of looks, you know, a little

goofy, a little hawkish. Yeah maybe. I mean, honestly, if

you look at it, if you, if you, if you googled this,

you'll know exactly what we're talking about. I'm not trying to be disrespectful,

but he looks that way. Well, I feel like an Italian could

comment on that coin better than say it, thank you, thank you a

Swiss guy? Yeah, yeah, yeah, I'm Italian by the way,

for those who don't know so, but didn't you know I'm a quarter Swiss.

I did not know a quarter? No? Yeah, yeah I am.

I'm finally impressed with that, are you? Oh yeah, you like

Swiss cheese. I love Swiss cheese. Oh well, there you go.

Figures And and I don't want to offend anybody, yeahrrect, you're right,

But anyway, I just thought that was interesting. And so Caesar, uh,

there's different Caesar's whose that's the title, And this is Tiberius. And

I also think it's amazing that they were so amazed. So Jesus uh talks

about money in such a way to where think about it, it feels like

it's meaningless. Whose pictures on here? Well, then give it to Caesar,

right, as if the coins don't even matter, right, it's not

mine he made it, didn't give it to him right? Right? And

they were amazed. And uh and by the way, I think also think

that it's interesting that the scripture gives us insight that Jesus knew their hearts.

It says that he knew their motivations, right. Uh, So I often

wonder all the time, I wonder this, did Jesus see it in the

way that everybody else could see it? Or Jesus, did Jesus use his

superpowers and know like maybe they were fantastic actors and nobody knew that they were

trying to be deceitful. And except for Jesus, I think he's smart enough

that at this point everything that comes to him from the phariseesus fake. Yeah,

yeah, yeah, for sure. And they're certainly making their grand standing

here. Oh you are so smart and you always give the right answer and

you're so truthful. So the reason why this is a trap is that the

average Jewish citizen hated paying taxes to Rome. Sure, so Rome had conquered

Israel. Israel was not free. They had conquered most of the known world

at that time, right the Mediterranean world, and so when you paid taxes,

it went to support the government, certainly, but it went beyond that,

you know, it supported the elite people, It supported the pagan temples,

it supported everything that the Jews were again, and then it was taking

their money to do it. And then there's just so much fraud and all

those things, and it was supporting your oppressor, right, so were their

oppressor was able to continue oppressing them because they were collecting taxes to be able

to continue to oppress you, you know what I mean. And so it

was this vicious cycle. They hated it. And so the reason why this

question was so clever was because if Jesus said, yeah, you should pay

your taxes, it woul sound like he supports Rome and he's an anti you

know, Israelite guy. Right on the other side, if he decides to

play to the people, which is what the Pharisees think, Jesus is always

doing. They think he's always just playing to the people. That's why they're

he's the king of the Jews, right, and they're so frustrated with him

all the time because they're always like, the people love him so much,

so they think he just tells the people what they want to hear. And

so they thought he would say or they were hoping he would say no,

no, no, just just do whatever you want to do, because that

corrupt pagan government they don't deserve your money. They use it in the wrong

way. They're supporting evil temples, all this stuff. You shouldn't pay your

taxes. Well, then now they can go to the governor and go,

hey, governor, this guy he claims to be the king of Jewseys telling

people quit paying taxes. The only thing that mattered to the Romans was taxes.

They didn't care about the people at all. They just wanted the taxes.

They continue feeding the war Masipan one of the taxes, and peace,

and they only wanted peace so that people can pay taxes, right right,

that's right they wanted to. And by the way, Tiberius was Caesar.

This this Caesar at that time, he was famous for continuing this policy of

we're going to maintain peace. It's going to be strength that maintains peace.

And the whole purpose is when nations are prosperous, they produce a lot more

resources and then you can tax them even more. Right, that's how the

rich you're richer. Yeah, and so, but the wars, whenever you

think of the Romans being such, you know, great warriors, the war

has always happened on the edges of the Roman Empire. They're constantly expanding.

It's because they had a giant Ponzi scheme. Essentially, if they didn't keep

taking more land, eventually the entire system would implode. Right, So they

kept having to take more land, but they were collecting taxes on the inside

interior in order to be able to supply the things on the outside, so

that they would be able to gain more land, gain more taxes, be

able to keep the rich richer. Right. Then, that's what the whole

system was, and it worked. It worked for hundreds and hundreds of years,

but so the people hated it. And this was a really tricky question.

So for Jesus to go just give to Caesar what Caesar's give to God,

what's God's totally takes away all the punch on both sides on most of

how they thought they would catch Jesus. Yeah, well, there's a sermon

in there that you that you alluded to. You said, people the Romans

probably thought that Jesus was going to tell the Jews what they wanted to hear,

right, Yeah, these leaders, the leaders thought Yeah, the leaders

thought that, right. And by the way, people still want that out

of church and out of the Bible and out of Jesus today. Right.

They want to hear what they want to hear. Right, And so some

you know, you and I do with that because we're pastors, but people

come in through the church doors and and you know, so so on a

on an upper level, you and I and others pray about what should get

said of the fifty two weeks of the year, right. And I always

believe that there are things that people want to hear, and then there are

things that people need to hear, right, yeah, And those are sort

of the two categories. And so Jesus often said things that people needed to

hear but did not want to hear. So Jesus was not that Jesus said

things that people. I mean, it challenge people, rub people, the

wrong way. You know, got people to understand and commit that, you

know, I mean, he said to the disciples, and he's about to

say, if you follow me, you're gonna die, right, right,

and then and then Peter for instance, still follows them, right. And

so yeah, he said things that people didn't want to hear all the time.

Yeah, and he corrected their lifestyle. They were constantly looking for loopholes

in the law. And he was saying, hey, if you just look

at a woman to lust after, it's the same as committing adultery. If

you just write you if you get angry enough that you would kill somebody,

it's the same as killing them. He goes beyond a lot of times.

He watches things up talking about motive. Now, whereas they had viewed their

entire face system being built around just obedience or disobedience, right, and now

he's questioning motives. Jesus really goes after it. But I think it's it's

one of those things, you know, when the Bible says that sin is

like a cancer in us, right. And I remember when when I had

cancer, I didn't want to hear the doctor tell me I had cancer.

But I needed the doctor to tell me I had cancer because I had to

do something about it, right, right, And that's how Jesus did it.

Jesus came in and my doctor came in. He was very compassionate.

Hey, jeff, I think I have news you don't want to hear.

But we've got a plan, right, And that's what Jesus did. Jesu

didn't come in he said, oh, you bunch of BOMs, you bunch

of sinners. Jesus said, hey, I got some things you don't want

to hear, but I've got a plan. And by the way, your

cancer free for how many years? Yeah? Three years? Three years,

three years. So I have some more tests coming up, but yeah,

it's really good. Right, So thank god, thank god we got in

time. Thank god this this doctor came in. I got bad news,

right, that's a jarring thing. But I've got a plan. Let's do

this. And it worked. And so I think that that's that's what Jesus

does. But the Pharisees and their religious leaders, because they did constantly try

to pander to the people, they project. You tend to project what you

do on others, and you project your motives on others sometimes, and so

because they were constantly trying to manipulate the people. They just assume that's what

Jesus was doing, was manipulating the people better than they were. Yeah.

Right, have you ever told something to somebody that they didn't want to hear?

And it's based on biblical truth, It's based on sort of maybe challenging

them. And then they respond by saying, don't judge me. Oh yeah,

yeah, dude, I'm not judging you. Isn't that one of the

most common things in this world today? Yeah? So, you know,

in a loving context relationship, I could set my brother down, for instance,

I'm just hypothetically saying, which I've done this in the past, by

the way, you know, and set them down. Hey, listen,

I want to challenge you. I see this is happening in your life.

This is not a good thing. Right, And then and then if they

respond with don't judge me, it's like, wait a minute, I'm not

judging you. I'm actually, you know, challenging you in the way that

God asks us, which, by the way, side notes, since I

brought it up, we're supposed to, as Christians lovingly judge insiders, but

the Bible tells us that we're not supposed to judge outs those outsalls literally uses

those words in Corinthians, right, which we have an entire podcast on that.

Yeah, that idea from several months ago. Yeah, he does.

Jesus says, you know by their fruit, you will know them right,

Right, So you don't have to be judgmental while you're looking at the fact

that the fruit somebody's putting out they claim to be an orange tree, but

they're putting out bananas. Well there's something wrong there. Yeah, that's not

being judgmental. You're claiming one thing, you're putting something else out. And

in that case, then if you really love that person, you're willing to

make a you know, have a conversation about it and lovingly try to correct

if they refuse it. Hey, that's that. So you know, at

the core of this passage, Jesus is identifying the fact that we have two

responsibilities. We're citizens of this world and we're citizens of heaven. Right,

so we have a responsibility to our government, and then we also have a

responsibility to Heaven. When those two conflict. We know, in the Book

of Acts, John says, you know, we'll obey God rather than man.

Right, But in the in this instance, Jesus is acknowledging. Hey,

governments are necessary. They're a thing that happened. You should, you

know, maintain your responsibility as a citizen of your nation. But I would

say this for Americans. Here's a little here's an interesting thing in America,

Chris, who is Caesar? In America? We are Caesar. We are

Caesar. That's right, if you ask them. I've asked so many people

this question and they always go, oh, the president of Caesar. No,

not in America. Right, It's not the five hundred and some odd

representatives and justices and you know, administrative people. It's it's not them,

it's us. We are Caesar. And so in this situation, then you

and I have to be because of your vote, because of the influence and

the power that you have as a free citizen, relatively free citizen, and

the relative power of your vote, then you have to use your power judiciously

in the same way that in this situation. Tiberius Caesar was a pretty good

guy, you know. The note says his administration was characterized by wisdom,

intelligence, prudence, and duty nice right, and he did a great job

leading the empire. At that time. It was a peaceful time as a

prosperous time. And it's in that context that Jesus said, let Caesar do

Caesar's thing. Well, you and I were citizens of heaven. We should

be doing the work of God. But we are also Caesar in our country,

and we have to leverage our ability to influence the movement of our and

the direction of our nation. We have to do it biblically and godly,

in a godly way, using prudence and wisdom and duty and all those kinds

of things. So in our situation, he's talking directly to you and me,

and we're one of the few people in history that have the kind of

power that he's talking about here. That's awesome. Yeah, there's a there's

a note in the Bible here that says Jesus avoided this trap by showing that

we have dual citizenship and then which you already talked about, and then it

references references one Peter two seventeen. So I looked it up in the NLT

version and it says, respect everyone, and love the family of believers,

Fear God, and respect the King. Oh yeah, right, So it's

talking about that same thing. It's talking about we're citizens of heaven and we're

citizens of the earth. Right, that's right, that's neat. So any

any last parting thoughts, I would say, are people going to listen to

this podcast and have questions about their own taxes? Like, I mean,

you know it's by the way, it's tax season, isn't it. Sure?

Yeah, so taxes are coming up. Yeah. I think you know,

the more educated you are, the better you are at managing your The

more educated about taxes, yes, you are the better. The more educated

yours to what you need to pay and what you shouldn't pay. I don't

think you should pay anymore. And you have to pay right, And then

I think that you need to leverage your vote and your influence so that your

taxes are used for better things. And then and then what about cheating people

out of there? What about cheating on your taxes? Well, Jesus is

against it, not for it, that's right. Well give the Caesar that

was just caesars. That's right, that's right, that's right. And and

so our government is all about we the people. So we should be giving

our money and you know a portion of our resources to the benefit of the

people. Yeah, yeah, okay, Well that's uh that's looks like that's

about our time, so hopefully we will see you next time on the Bible

guys. H