United Irvine Podcast - Ep 10: Dorothy Urquhart

Welcome back to United Irvine Church podcast.

And we have the privilege of having my dear wife, Dorothy G.

Just turned 64, that's right.

Yes, just caught up with me.

And it's always dangerous interviewing your wife because she sees you afterwards as well.

But it's fantastic to have Dorothy here.

And there's a first question, Dorothy, that we usually ask, and it is if you could visit or meet someone in history other than Jesus Christ, who might it be and why?

Yes, uh you mentioned this on the car on the way here, so that I had lots of time to think about who.

But the first name that popped into my head is actually not somebody that I know an awful lot about, but I'm gonna say Florence Nightingale, who was a lady in the First World War who basically set up the modern nursing and hospital systems, because Florence was a woman that got things done.

She saw a need and it was dangerous, and it was there was going to be lots of opposition, and in those days the men did everything and the women just did what they were told.

So Florence was having none of that, and she made a huge difference and saved many, many lives, and really set us on the path towards health care as we know it now, or as it can be.

Yes, you you you do like when we watch movies, you do like a feisty lead lady, don't you?

Definitely, yeah, and uh well that that would describe you in some respects.

Um but tell us about your childhood, Dorothy.

Tell us about we're gonna get to eventually Scripture Union and your role there with the local primary school, but uh and we'll go around the houses as well, but but tell us a bit about your childhood and and coming to faith and growing up in faith.

Yeah, well I was born in 1962, the number two in a family that became five children and mum and dad.

And uh we my childhood was in Glasgow, and it was a real privilege to be born into a Christian family.

Mum and dad were very committed Christians, and we went to church every Sunday, and they lived out in their lives.

They were people of service.

My dad was a doctor, my mum had been a nurse, but was a full-time mum to five children, and we had a very happy childhood in Glasgow in the uh Kelvendale.

And looking back, I see that we didn't have a or my parents had we had lots of friends out with the family, but as far as pals, I did have school pals, but I didn't need home pals because I had all my siblings.

So we were a gang and we did lots of things together.

And one of the things that we did together was going to a Crusader group on a Sunday afternoon.

So this is back in the day where there was nothing to do on a Sunday.

So we went to church in the morning, came home, had lunch, usually with visitors because my mum and dad would have scooped up some people at church to bring home for lunch.

And then we would go to Crusaders in the afternoon, which was like an SU group, it was for children of a range of school age mostly, run by a fantastic guy called Forbes Pearson.

And Crusaders was the gateway to lots of adventures because we went to camps, we went to weekends away, and that was the gateway to okay, this is cool.

There are other young people who believe this stuff about Jesus and God, it's not just my family who are a bit strange.

So there were times when I believed that my family was a bit strange, but meeting other people from other places, other teenagers that I thought were cool, uh, that helped a lot.

So Crusaders was very important.

Um, but there was there was a moment that sometimes I I never didn't know about Jesus and God and and the difference that that makes in your life.

But when I was about 10 or 11, we were up in Easter Ross in the villages that we still visit called Hilton, Ballantor, and Shandwick.

And there was a minister there called Tom Patterson, and he used to run a holiday club every summer.

Excuse me, and one particular summer, when I was about 10 or 11, Tom from the front, uh, or Mr.

Patterson, as we would have called him, he asked us in front of a big group of children, so boys and girls, put your hand up if you are a follower of Jesus, if you're a Christian, and and I was mad because I didn't want to put my hand up.

I was trying to blend in with the group and I didn't want to be singled out.

So I did the move where you you might be scratching your ear or you might be putting your hand up.

It was a very half-hearted kid on that he would see me, but nobody else might see me.

And then I felt immediately embarrassed and ashamed that I had done that, and on the way home from the church to where we lived in Manana and Granda's house, I'm riding my bike along, and I was giving myself such a telling off.

That was ridiculous.

You know what Jesus has done for you, you know that you needed to stand up for him there and you let him down.

That was humiliating.

Don't ever do that again.

Make up your mind right now.

Are you or are you not a follower of Jesus?

And I was really cross with myself, and I and I decided I am.

Me, me, not my mum and dad, not my brothers and sisters, just me.

I am gonna live this way.

And nothing dramatically changed at that point.

We just carried on doing what we were already doing.

Uh uh, but that was important for me, that was in me making my own decision, and as I said, the crusader groups and all the things that we did then encouraged us to continue uh growing up in life and in faith.

Tremendous.

And you trained to be a nurse and did sick kids nursing, but before that you took a year out in Kenya?

Yeah, I did I always wanted to be a nurse.

My mum was a nurse, m had been a nurse, my dad was a doctor, and other siblings went on to be m doctors, but I always knew that nursing would be better for me because I like to look after people.

So I did general nursing at the College of Technology in Glasgow, and then I knew that I wanted to do sick children's nursing, so I was booked for that, but I was going to have a wee gap, uh three months in Kenya with a missionary friend of my mum and dad's, and three months turned into 11 months.

I was in Kitui in Kenya with a lady called Katie McKinnon, who had a baby home for uh malnourished children, and we had sometimes I think about 50 children living in a compound, and I uh Katie and I were looking after them nursing-wise.

This is just as AIDS was kind of coming on the scene.

It was just as AIDS was being recognised as why lots of people were dying.

Um, and that's why I've never been able to be a blood donor ever since, because as soon as they see that on my history, they say, Oh no, we don't want your blood, thank you very much.

Not that I ever had anything, although I did once uh donate blood in Uganda in the when I was on an eye safari with a doctor from Southampton Eye Hospital, I got seconded to go and help him, and somebody was basically bleeding out in the theatre and they were looking for blood donations, and as they were putting an enormous needle into my arm, I thought, oof, let's pray that this is a sterile needle, because that that was probably not a very wise thing to do.

But when you're there and someone is literally in a life-threatening situation, yes, so that would be a transforming year for you.

Yes, it certainly put a different perspective on material things and what you needed to live because people had almost nothing, and yet they were very uh cheerful and full of faith, and uh I saw how little you actually need.

I'm sure I've drifted from that and been quite materialistic at times, but underneath I don't forget that you don't need the stuff.

And you came back and went to Aberdeen to to study uh sick kids nursing and we bumped into each other.

Yeah it wasn't until two years later that romance blossomed, of course.

But tell us tell us about the sick kids nursing and uh you were involved in Glasgow.

I just always knew that I needed to be around children and uh I loved it.

I would have done it if they hadn't paid me.

I just loved it.

I I think I would have I used to say that I would have been emotionally stunted if I hadn't worked with children because you get lots of hugs, and not that I'm a huge hugger, but I you know I like I just got I knew that it was in the right place when I was working with children.

And we married and landed in Irvine and have had our own children.

Yeah.

And that was what you were devoted to.

Yeah, for the first uh until Sandy, our oldest was about 10, I was really a full-time home housewife, which I also loved because you're your own boss if you're a housewife and you can decide and plan what am I doing today.

And I've always been somebody that was a self-starter.

I I like to just take things on and tackle them and crack on.

So when Sandy was in primary six, I I don't really remember how it started, but I decided that I would try and start an SU group, and we had people at church who were willing to help with that.

So every Wednesday after school, we had the we had an a friend of the family called Betty Woodrow, and without Auntie Betty, we couldn't have done it because I had younger children who needed to be looked after while I did SU for the hour on Wednesdays after school.

So used to drop uh Auntie Betty used to come down to the school and meet Amy and Zoe in the playground and take them to her house, and Sandy and I would stay for SU.

And that was 26 years ago, as he's now 36.

So I've been doing SU at the same school on the same day at the same time for 26 years.

And it's changed a bit over the years.

Of course, it used to happen in Loud Montgomery primary school hall and library or quiet room, and now that changed at COVID, did it?

It did.

We weren't allowed in the school over COVID, so everything came to a standstill.

And then even afterwards, we were kind of ready to start up again, but no visitors were allowed in the school.

So, with a lot of support from Scripture Union Central Office, a late uh Carol Baird, who was our regional worker at the time, did all the risk assessment paperwork, which I would not have had the patience to do.

And she got us all set up with all the documentation, and the head teacher was happy for us to come and pick up the children from school, walk them along 15-20 minutes to connections and have our meeting in the church buildings instead of at the school.

Initially, we thought that oh, this walk is going to be quite a chore, uh, but we'll just do it, and we'll have to.

Some of the kids would be picked up at the church and some would be dropped off back at the school after, so we had to walk there and walk back.

But we quickly realized that actually the walk is the best part sometimes because on the walk the kids chat to you, they tell you what's happened in school today, they tell you all about stuff from home that probably the parents would rather they didn't tell you.

But we have all the chat of the day on the way along and on the way back.

And by the time we get to Connections, they're they've had some exercise, they've they've sort of de-stressed from the classroom environment.

And at Connections we've got much more room, and nobody's walking through on their way out, there's no distractions.

Got the that room, big room to ourselves, so we discovered it's much better.

So even though we could be back at the school now, we said no, we prefer it like this.

And we've got usually most years we've got about 20 children, primary six and seven, from just that school, Lyon Montgomery.

And the school are incredibly supportive.

The head teach all the different head teachers have all seen the value of getting other people being involved in the kids, a positive role models.

One of the head teachers also mentioned that for some of the children they only have home and school as the places that they go to where they feel safe and and part of things.

So adding in home, school, and our church buildings, our community centre building is a positive.

That's another place where they know they know they belong there and they're part of what's going on there.

So I do it because I love it.

I do it because the children are involved, I do it because every year uh God provides other people who want to do it too.

And uh the sometimes my grown-up children say, Are you still doing SU?

What you know, when are you gonna stop?

I have no idea when I'm gonna stop.

I'll stop when I need whenever it seems to be the right time.

It might be when you retire in three years, I'm not sure.

Well, I'm I'm sure it will have to stop then, but uh at the moment uh it just feels right to be doing this.

So and you're starting to get kids through whose parents were in the Scripts Union away back in the 20s.

Yes, I think this is the first time that somebody's I'm quite used to children saying, Oh, my big sister used to come to SU or my big brother used to come to SU, and now somebody said, My mum used to come to SU, and it was still me that was doing it.

So that's that's fine.

I'm happy with that.

One of the reasons why we have such a strong group is because there's a tradition now through many families that this is what they do.

We we meet every Wednesday on a Wednesday for from pick up the kids at three, drop them back at the school at half past four, but we also take them on an annual residential, a weekend away at the Lendrick Muir Centre, which is run by Scripture Union, and that's an absolute highlight.

I still meet people in their 30s.

Oh, hi Darcy! Remember that time you took us to Lendrick Muir and we did this and that and the other.

So that lets the children have the experience of ah, here are other children and adults who are Christians and followers of Jesus, and from other schools, other places, and instantly when we get there, the the atmosphere of a Christian family, all the leaders gathering, we and we don't know each other either, but we are all there for the same reason.

And even very tricky children, excuse me, that I've taken and head teachers have been saying, Are you sure you want to take so and so away for two whole nights?

And I'm now I'm completely confident that we will be fine because as soon as we get Jimmy and Margaret to into that environment, things change and they thrive surrounded by God's love and and the prayerful atmosphere and the fun and the games and the the values of truth and concern for one another.

And uh these young people who grow up and uh don't necessarily come to church services, but we've bumped into and met, as you just mentioned, young folk who reflect on these times with Scripture Union and you also you you train them to read the Bible too.

They that one of the highlights is the they receive from you from from us the uh a Bible that that's really gonna help them.

Yeah, I give them we give them now at the very beginning, when they arrive at SU they get a good news youth version Bible, and the youth version is a big, heavy, chunky, hardback Bible, but it's got blanks on the margins.

So, excuse me, some of them have got little puzzles to do or something to highlight in the text, and some of them are blank.

So if you're a doodler or a person who likes to draw, this is their own Bible, and I always emphasize it's got lots of writing and not a lot of pictures, but you you can add things at the sides, and it's your Bible for life.

And we every week obviously we have something from the Bible.

Uh in fact, and when I went into class for P6 this year, and I said, Does anybody know what SU is about?

And one week I hand shot up, she said, I know, I know.

Uh you play games and you talk about God, and I said, Exactly right, that's it.

So we uh we talk about the Bible being not a book, but a library, and all the different kinds of books that you get in the library, all the genres, you know, history, poetry, fantasy, horror, you name it, it's all in there.

And uh yes, we teach them as you know light touch as we can, it's not a heavy thing, but about finding the plea looking up the page number, finding the chapter, finding the verse.

But it's always about uh, oh, that's a really fun story, very interesting.

So what?

What in what way is that relevant to me?

So we're always trying to apply it to the lives that the children are leading at the age of 10 and 11.

And we believe that SU Group makes a difference in their week because they enjoy it and they've got people there who are interested in them and listening to them, but it can make a difference for their whole life, and that's what we're praying for, and believing that God will work in their lives, and we won't know, we might not know about that, we won't see it, but uh it's very rewarding, and I I don't I don't really have a theme for my life, but that the verse that has often been applicable is uh whatever you're doing, put your whole heart into it as though you were doing it for the Lord, and it's not as though I am, I actually am, and I go all out full pelt on whatever it is I'm doing.

Some people call that obsessional, but uh it's been a very rewarding obsession, and I I like to make things, I like to come at stuff from different angles, and so all of that need in me is being met by, or not all of it, but you know, it's an outlet for me.

I get to make up stuff and plan new things, creative spirit, yeah.

Do artist stuff and Christmas stuff and uh all of that, you know.

Some we I we did a sketch many years ago at an SU event where uh it the impression was given that actually I do SU for my foot only for myself, and it was a surprise to me that it was meant to be for the children, you know.

So this is lovely, yeah.

And it's a training ground for for folk as well, young folk, but older folk too, and in and leading these sorts of groups, but also finding out about ourselves.

Tell us tell us a wee bit about the training ground.

In fact, recently someone came to you saying, Oh, please, I want to help.

Yes, uh the kids love it when we have teenage helpers, and we love it when we have teenage helpers because they're cool and trendy, and we and some of the rest of us are not.

So usually the balance in the leadership is about three or four people in in early retirement, or about 60.

So we've got the grandparent age group, and then sometimes we have somebody in their 20s, maybe a youth worker from the church, or someone who's not able to work for some reason and is able to help us.

And then we love having teenagers, so we have people from fourth year to sixth year in school, and they rush down after school.

And uh, one we one lead assistant leader that we have now isn't just started, and when she came to SU as a pupil, she had a she was having a really hard time in her life, and every week this girl would come to SU and Every week there would be some reason why she would end up crying.

And we used to think, gosh, it's really hard, like hard to be that girl.

She's struggling, but she comes every week.

And uh every more often she used to say, I'll come back, Dorothy, when I'm in how old to have to be again?

Well, you've got to be in fourth year.

I'll come back.

And you know, children say things and you think, Oh, that would be lovely, but you know, you believe it might or might not happen.

And on the very last week of SU before the summer, there, we bumped into her in the street, and she was smiling and ran up to us and said, Dorothy, I'm in fourth year.

I've started, I'm in fourth year.

Can I come?

So she came and she was at a leader's meeting, she was at SU last week, she was at a leaders' meeting, she she's chatting, she's contributing.

Oh, I've got an idea for that, and I can't quite believe it.

That here is this girl.

And when we I said to her, Do you remember that you used to cry every week?

And she said, Yeah, I was going through a very emotional time, but I'm fine now.

So I'm just delighted to have that girl, and and over the years, people have just every summer.

I think, oh dear, are we going to be able to continue after the summer?

We might not have enough leaders, and every year other leaders come, other people appear.

So we're still going, and we we love it.

I know, and the school, the relationship with the school has been has been precious and special, and you've you've also been, I mean, you've really been a unpaid teacher, uh, Lloud Montgomery, at many times when you've helped with various things.

Tell us, tell us a bit about that.

Well, it it started uh way back when we used to have assemblies and you needed somebody to play the piano for a hymn or a song at assembly.

And it uh then it developed into, oh, could you come and play the piano and could you choose the songs?

So I was like, Yeah, beauty, I'll choose the songs.

I've got a lot, you know, we and we started a long period of using fishy music CDs, and uh so that developed into then could we what songs should we have for harvest?

What songs should we do at Christmas?

And and now it's really I'm sort of the director producer of the Christmas and sometimes Easter end of term musical, singing, dancing, you name it, everyone involved, school end-of-term thing.

So that again, that's been fun for me.

Thanks for letting me do it.

You know, I'm delighted to get involved in stuff like that.

It does become like most projects, you really enjoy it at the beginning, and then it becomes jolly hard work, but you press on and get it done, and the rewards are tremendous.

So uh having the opportunity to work with all the children in the school and having the opportunity to make sure that the Christmas celebrations are about Jesus, they're about the real Christmas, not Santa and elves and presents has been tremendous opportunity for many years.

It's great.

In fact, the new head at Louden Montgomery uh is is just starting, is very keen for that.

Triumvirate that uh Mr.

Blakely talked about the community centre and the church and the school, these th we work together very closely.

Yeah.

And in fact, I believe she was in Irvine Royal Academy when I was a chaplain as a pupil.

That's a bit scary.

You're also ancient, absolutely.

We are we're ancient together.

But it's it's w what are your prayers for these young people and for the school relationship?

You know, we're we're gonna be moving on in time, but we we pray for we pray for this ministry and ministries like this to continue, don't we?

Of course, we've got thank T T GIF, which is uh teens growing in faith on Friday nights and jump just before it as a transition from primary to secondary and Benjamin and company working with the young people, helping the young people to to to grow up.

But but we're we're we're also involved in training young people and other people to to be the successors, aren't we?

It's gonna be so important.

Yeah, it's very easy if you're if you've been doing something for a long time to just do it and uh you end up doing far too much yourself and not delegating and not training people.

So that's the challenge, to uh let go of some of the things that I've always done, and to enable other people to to get involved in those and to let them see what what happens behind the scenes instead of just doing all the stuff behind the scenes and smoothing the path for everyone.

Uh that that's a that's a challenge for bringing up children, you know.

If you've been a mother who smooths the path all the time and makes things easy for them, and then you're not there, you need to make sure that you are uh be yes, being a good example, but also letting go and letting them and trusting them and enabling them to sometimes learn the hard way.

So that's that's a part of it.

You don't nobody want so it's about sort of honest feedback, really, then and how we do meet once a fortnight and in our leadership team, and we talk about the last two weeks, how have they gone, what might we have done differently.

And sometimes things don't go well, and we have to say, how could we have done that better?

Um, and we also, when we meet like that, we pray for the children by name.

We have we have our lists, and at some point we get them to write a a kind of sheet about what their interests are, what they would like to be when they grow up, and we use those to pray for the children and we just believe that God can can and will work in their lives and that doing that makes a difference.

Brilliant.

And you like love a bit of a splash at the end of the year, don't you?

Tell us about as we come to a close, tell us about the I mean it's this risky s uh side of things, you know, that you Yeah, yeah.

I like a bit of jeopardy, I like a bit of uh risk assessment, forget it, you know.

But uh we the the kids love it if you make something do something that they they reckon you probably shouldn't be letting them do.

So we have an annual water fight outside on the grass, outside connections, and it is a controlled water fight because we fill a whole lot of buckets of water at the beginning, and then once the water's gone, the the whole thing's over.

But we do four different activities involving the water where we're having fun with it but trying to keep it, and then the last ten minutes is uh sponges in the buckets which act like extreme wet snowballs, and it's just a free-for-all, everyone can soak everybody else, and they get to pelt the leaders, and we all end up absolutely drenched.

So we that's a big highlight for the kids and the leaders as well, because we love it too.

Marvellous, marvellous.

Well, thanks so much, Dorothy, for being so open and the best as you continue through this season and uh terms.

And uh yeah, we pray on for these young people and these leaders as they grow up, and also for the future that that uh we will see people coming through who take on these roles of different ministries that we've been involved in.

And do subscribe to United Irvine Church podcast.

Do subscribe and uh have a look back to see other other podcasts and tune in in future.

It's gonna be great speaking to you and listening to you, Dorothy.

Thank you.

Thanks for being with us, folks.