Conversation - with Pastor Jared and Pastor Robby - Overcomers Week 4

Welcome to the Church of the Lakes Kingdom Conversations Podcast.

At Church of the Lakes, our mission is connecting all to Christ to become healthy in God and courageous in love.

In 2026, we're emphasizing a kingdom mindset in all of our ministries and missions by being more like Jesus and countercultural in our living.

Today's podcast dives deeper into our current sermon series, Overcomers, a study of the book of Revelation.

Join Pastor Jared and Pastor Robbie as they talk about trusting in Jesus who has overcome and claiming that hope and strength as followers of the King.

Be blessed.

Welcome to another Kingdom Conversation.

I'm Pastor Robbie Strack, and today we are working through our study on the book of Revelation called Overcomers.

And this week we are diving deeper into Revelation 11, where we discover two witnesses who are granted authority to prophesy.

And even in the midst of their prophecy, we see things like persecution.

We see things like death.

But praise the Lord that the story doesn't end there as the chapter goes on.

We see a foreshadow of resurrection.

And to help us unravel these scriptures from Revelation chapter 11, the theology, the application points, just a little bit deeper than in the sermon that he gave to us just a couple of days ago.

Revelation 11 · chapter mention

It's Pastor Jared Preesead.

What's going on?

Jared, how are you, brother?

I'm doing well.

I appreciate you asking.

Thank you.

Yeah, you're welcome.

I'm excited to dive a little bit deeper into this next uh segment, this next window, really, right?

This is a new window from John.

Yes.

Okay.

8 to 11.

8 to 11.

So, so really we're getting to the culmination of this window where God sends these two witnesses right into the mess, right?

That's what you said in your sermon, that God sends his witnesses right into the mess.

Now, my question to you would be then, with that in mind, what does that tell us about God's mission in the world?

And how does that really challenge the temptation for Christians to withdraw into a Christian bubble where we're all isolated and we're not out there witnessing anymore?

Uh, can you kind of unravel that a little bit more for us?

First, let me, you know, you mentioned the two witnesses.

Sure.

Yeah.

I think over the course of church history, some have looked at that as two literal people that will come to earth prior to Christ's return.

But you you came to a different kind of thing.

Yeah, yeah.

As I've looked and did some research, I see that more as a representation of just the witness of the church.

Gotcha.

In in the midst of our of any generation that the church finds itself in.

Can we see a little bit of that in Revelation 11 when he talks of it?

John writes about the lampstands, and we see the lampstands.

Yeah, the lampstand unit that are the churches.

Revelation 1, and the Christ's presence among his churches is indicative of the lampstands indicative of that.

Um, but but when you said about you know God sending his witnesses into the mess, uh, one reason I want to make that clarification for my own uh answer to this question is just simply that I think the witnesses represent those of us in the church that are called to be on mission with God in the midst of our generation.

And uh certainly uh it's an interesting uh reality that God sends his witnesses, his people into the mess of this world.

And I really think as you look through the biblical narrative and also church history, I think that's God's normal strategy.

Uh it's not to remove his people from broken places, rather, it's to send his people into the broken places uh with the message that can make those places whole again, in those people whole again.

It reminded me of the Japanese art form kinsugi.

Oh yeah, like the gold uh mix in there, yeah.

Yeah, and just thought I thought of it in this moment about how they intentionally break pottery and then uh mold it back together with gold glue.

And it it brings a beauty into the the artwork that wouldn't have been there otherwise.

But I feel like as a church, we're kind of that gold glue.

And God sends us in with the message of Christ into places to put them back together.

So that really does change the way that we should think about our mission and purpose as a church, right?

Well, you know, reminding me of John 17, where Jesus prays for the church, he says, you know, as Father, you sent me into the world, so now I send my disciples into the world.

So Christian community isn't fundamentally retreat from the world, it's participation in God's mission for the world.

Uh I think again, this is especially important when you get to Revelation.

Uh why do I say that?

Because, you know, in the day and age where John was writing the revelation to even now, nearly 2,000 years later, the surrounding culture is hostile, it's idolatrous, it's resistant to God, and yet God still places his witnesses in the world.

Uh so in other words, darkness isn't evidence that Christians should leave the world.

The darkness is precisely why Christians are in the world.

Oh, that's good to shine the light of Christ.

You are the light of the world, Jesus says in Matthew chapter 5.

Matthew 5 · chapter mention

Um also making me think of, I know last week we talked a little bit about uh Wesley and theology and history.

And John Wesley, uh, you know, when he was kicked out of the Church of England, uh, because you know, he he had a message of it was radical evangelism.

Yeah, that people who the church at that time didn't deem worthy of being part of the church, John Wesley said, Absolutely not, they deserve Christ as much as anyone.

And I, you know, I still remember in in his writings where he uh looked at a bishop of his day, and the bishop said, You have no place, no parish to preach Jesus.

And John Wesley said back to him, Well, the world is my parish.

And I think as Christians, we need to see the world as our parish.

Uh, you know, we belong here because the message of Christ belongs here and is uh a necessary, the most necessary component of of wherever we find ourselves.

So just as John Wesley preached Jesus in the marketplace, in open fields, uh wherever people were to reach them, we too must go into the marketplace and in our homes and communities and and preach the saving message of Jesus so broken people can have a chance to be made whole again.

Well, and you bring up broken people once again, and God sending these witnesses in chapter eleven.

You know, how does that really then change how our heart should be oriented towards people who are far from him?

Like it seems a pretty easy jump to make that we are to chase after these people and witness to them, right?

Not just to stay stationary as a church, but to move outside.

Yeah, and nobody initially would say nobody's beyond the grace of God.

Uh, you know, God had uh has bestowed his grace upon all who will receive it.

And so, you know, there's certainly a place for Christian community.

Uh we gather in order to be scattered, right?

You know, like that.

Uh we gather to be strengthened, to be encouraged, to be motivated, okay, to to be reminded again of the message of the gospel that we are called to carry into all of our places of influence.

And yeah, we gather on Sundays or in small groups in order to be scattered out into the world.

So the question in my mind, it becomes uh, where has God already placed me where his witness is is needed?

Not do I got to go find the places where the witness is needed, but God, where have you placed me already?

And where have you given me a level of uh a certain degree of influence to where I can then offer a witness?

So it's more of like a self-reflection then, because then people need to be able to reflect on where they do have influence, yeah, and then go make uh a witness in that in that specific circle, as you said.

And I'm excited already as you're talking for next year, and we're gonna be focusing a lot on leadership and influence.

Spoiler for those who listen to the podcast, yeah.

I love it.

Um, well, you also mentioned grace here just a second ago.

You know, Wesley talked about grace as something God is constantly giving us before we even recognize him often at times, uh, which is really relevant when we're talking about uh being witnesses, right?

We call that provenient grace, right?

Um, is the fancy, you know, Wesleyan term.

But how might that idea of provenient grace, once again, God, you know, granting us grace even before we recognize him, how does that change the way we look at the people around us then?

Like, could God already be at work in someone's life before we even ever share the gospel with them then?

Absolutely.

Oh, okay.

I I think probably one of the greatest contributions of Wesleyan theology into the life of the church is this idea of provenient grace.

Okay.

Uh that this coming before.

Uh, you know, really, we don't even come to salvation uh on our own accord.

No, no, no.

The Holy Spirit illuminates our need for salvation, and that is uh a degree of provenient grace.

And so uh with that said, we never bring Jesus into somebody's life where Jesus hasn't already been working.

Uh again, provenient grace is God going before us to prepare and uh set the table, so to speak.

Uh so before somebody recognizes Christ, confesses Christ, responds consciously to Christ, God is already graciously working.

He's awakening, he's convicting, he's drawing, he's enabling a response.

To give a crass illustration, I apologize for that.

You know, the summer I met my wife Meredith, uh, we were both working at a camp for inner city youth, and I found myself immediately having an attraction to her.

Don't think she felt the same about Jared.

And so I had to come up with ways to make myself noticed to her, you know, and then you uh buffed out there doing push-ups and knowing.

My red shorts, but uh uh but I had to make I had to do something to make her notice me.

Yeah, okay, you know, and then also not only notice me, but but see that I desired to have some type of a relationship with her.

And at that point, she had to say, okay, yes, I want a relationship with this guy or may I get lost, not my type, right?

And so provenient grace leads us to the place of where we are aware of God's presence, God's love, God's trying to woo us into relationship with him.

Once that's illuminated, once we've become aware of that, then it's a oh, um, yes, I want to engage this relationship, or no, Lord, get lost.

And so to me, looking at that framework, it changes evangelism tremendously.

Okay, why do you say that?

Instead of approaching somebody thinking, Man, I've got to make something happen here, it is completely incumbent upon my witness.

It's instead approaching the person saying, Holy Spirit, what have you already been doing here that I can now cooperate or partner with you in that work?

And so the responsibility is on the Lord.

Well, that should make it more freeing, then, shouldn't it?

Because Oh, very much so.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Um, definitely.

Yep, I would say yes.

That makes it way more freeing.

The responsibility isn't on me, it's it's I'm just simply partnering with the Lord with what the Lord's already doing.

Not that he needs my partnership, but that he wants my partnership.

I know, how cool is that that he was used.

Yeah, he wants our partnership.

That's great.

Um, we were talking before the podcast, before we hit the record button, about Mark IV, and I can't help but um let my mind drift there once again about Jesus' parable of the sower of the seeds.

The sower goes out there and sows the seeds.

Now, of course, it falls on the path, and then uh, you know, the thorny, rocky ground, and then the good soil.

Those are the four things.

Yeah.

And uh, I can't help but think uh it's just our job to be the sower of the seed.

It's it's God who's gonna who's gonna actually make it grow, then, right?

In the illustration, right?

Yeah.

But you know, you also mentioned that because of this in your sermon, the freeing sense of this transition that it, you know, the Holy Spirit is the power behind this that makes it happen.

That means as witnesses that we can offer truth without hostility, conviction without cruelty, courage without arrogance, or grace and grace without compromise.

So, what does it actually look like to develop that kind of Christ-like character?

How does the Holy Spirit really help come into us and make this happen over time, Jared?

I you know, can you help us flesh that out a little bit?

I think I initially would say that the the the qualities you speak of aren't primarily communication techniques, they're simply fruit of sanctification.

Okay.

It's it's just, you know, process we're into becoming holy as Christ is holy.

You know, I think as we talked last week, this idea that we are already perfected and we are being perfected.

Uh, this idea that, you know, when we come to faith in the Lord, we have our have his imputed righteousness covering us.

So we have been made perfected.

You know, we uh we are now worthy of heaven because Christ's righteousness is what clothes us.

But there's also an imparted righteousness where the Holy Spirit gets in us and does the work of sanctifying us.

Uh sanctifying grace would be a Wesleyan terminology.

That it's it's it's it's allowing us, uh giving us the capacity to become holy as Christ is holy.

And so the idea of evangelizing and being able to offer truth without hostility, conviction without cruelty, courage without arrogance.

What was the last one?

Uh grace without compromise.

It really is to me a fruit of sanctification.

Uh the more sanctified we become, the easier we we are able to do that type of evangelizing.

And so the the Holy Spirit changes not merely what we believe, but the kind of people that we're becoming because of what we believe.

Um we need to have a heart that is increasingly uh in love with the people we're trying to evangelize for the purpose of winning them over to Christ.

Like when I pursue people and evangelize, it's not uh I I don't want to do it with hostility, I don't want to do it with with cruelty because I want them to become my brother and sister, you know, in in faith.

I want them to be part of the family of God.

Uh and and so I want to win them over with speaking truth in love, with offering a conviction that stirs within them a motivation to want to change in ways that honor the God who created them.

Uh you know, I I think we can learn apologetics and evangelism techniques, but it's only the Holy Spirit that can make us increasingly like Jesus.

And so again, Wesley understood sanctification as God's grace progressively transforming us so that holy love increasingly governs our heart, uh, particularly for those who are lost and those who are far from God.

Um is there an assumption, because there are some people who may be uncomfortable with being a quote unquote verbal witness, right?

But they're, as we're gonna discover next year in the year 2027, when we look at leadership, we are all witnesses through the way that we live, whether it's verbally, nonverbally, um, spiritual practices, disciplines is what we like to call them.

Um, how do practices that people physically see, like things that we see, like going to worship, commun, you know, partaking in communion, reading scripture, prayer, going to small groups, missions, how do these prepare us to become better witnesses in the midst of uh allowing the Holy Spirit to transform us?

All those things that you're mentioning, uh, their means of grace.

Yep.

You you mentioned provenient grace, I mentioned sanctifying grace, you know.

John Wesley would have a process of grace.

Provenient grace is wooing us to the Lord.

Uh, you know, once we're aware that he has a desire to be in relationship, it moves into justifying grace.

We have to choose do we want to engage this relationship or not?

And if we say yes, then in that very moment it it's a the process of sanctifying grace that begins to work in our life that makes us holy as as as Christ is holy.

And so um, the means of grace, with all of that said, they don't earn God's favor.

Okay.

Uh they they simply position us to receive and respond to God's transforming grace.

Okay.

Again, classic Wesley.

Uh, prayer, for instance, you mentioned prayer, it teaches us dependence.

Uh, scripture reshapes our minds around God's truth and not our truth or the world's truth, right?

Uh worship, you mentioned worship, it reorder reorders our love.

Uh communion continually brings us back to Christ's saving work and nourishes us by his grace.

Uh, Christian community exposes our blind spots and gives us encouragement and accountability.

I absolutely love that we're a church not with small groups but of small groups.

I like that.

Because those are the that's the context where people can really grow and be encouraged and held accountable.

Uh serving, we're a church that's very outward focused.

Uh serving others, it trains us to move beyond ourselves.

Uh put all those together and then something begins to happen, right?

God forms us into a certain kind of person.

Uh a person that's formed by and a representative of Christ.

And so the means of grace are therefore not an escape from mission.

They simply prepare us for the mission, for evangelism, uh, gather around the table, around prayer, around community, and then we carry the life of Christ into the world in which we live.

And that's where the evangelism, I think, can can be most effective.

Okay, but let me play.

And the witness can be most effective.

Let me play.

Let's put the shoe on the other foot, as they say, okay?

If we aren't the ones as witnesses who change hearts, it's the Holy Spirit that does.

Yes.

How do we even have a sense of responsibility to actively engage as witnesses with our dependence upon God's grace, you know, to actually transform a person's life?

But, you know, couldn't we just wash our hands and say it's not on us?

We could, definitely.

Um, you're making me think of the the message, the statement I made in my sermon the other day about um how I had a friend who whose pastor used to have tally marks in the front of his Bible, and uh underneath above the tally marks was the statement, People I have saved.

And even as a young young person, I was probably 15, 16 years old when he used to show off his Bible.

I I'd always scratch my head thinking, you don't you don't save anyone, Jesus does.

Like you don't change hearts, the Holy Spirit changes the hearts.

Um, and it's true, we you know, we don't have to listen.

Here's here's the reality: we don't have to do anything, and God's will will still prevail.

Yeah.

But but God's desire is to use us in partnership to to move His His will forward because He desires to be in relationship with us, He desires partnership with us.

Um, and so that there is this Wesleyan uh idea, this concept that could be helpful here.

Okay, and it's the idea, you know, we've been talking a lot about grace, yeah, uh cooperating grace.

Okay.

So God acts first.

Again, God awakens, God convicts, God draws, God empowers, but then God graciously invites human participation.

Uh I think Paul captures this beautifully.

I mentioned it in my sermon the other day out of 1 Corinthians 3.

I planted, Apollos watered, but it is God that gave the growth.

Paul really planted.

Yes.

Apollos really watered.

Yes.

God really produced the growth.

Yes, he did.

That's evangelism.

Okay.

That's witness.

My responsibility is faithfulness.

God's responsibility is transformation.

Uh, and I think that frees us really from two errors.

Okay.

One is the error of passivity, which you're talking about.

Listen, God changes heart, so I don't need to do anything.

The other uh frees us from the error of pressure.

Well, if this person doesn't believe, then I must have failed.

Neither is biblical.

We witness boldly and we trust deeply.

We pray, we love, we invite, we speak the gospel, we answer questions, we share our testimony, we create opportunities, and then we trust the Holy Spirit with what we cannot do.

Uh as I said the other day, I cannot save anybody, but God can use my faithful witness as one of the means through which his grace reaches and saves somebody.

Okay.

So it's cooperating grace.

Okay.

So to help as an illustration, perhaps you could view Wesley's description of these different types of graces as like a river or stream.

Uh, that's great, yeah.

So, like, can you help us put them kind of in in order?

Like, so provenient grace would come first, right, to a person, right?

Um, then it's justifying grace, and finally sanctifying grace, right?

And there's like there's also glorifying grace, which is Okay, where does that fit?

Where does cooperating grace fit into?

Uh glorifying grace would be on the other side of the grave.

Okay.

Um cooperating grace just I I would I would plant that anywhere.

Okay.

Um you know, uh on the the river of grace, so to speak.

Uh God can use other people as a mechanism of prevenient grace in another's life.

Uh justify, you know, the other day at church we had somebody give their life to Christ, and I I was able to kneel by him and ask him very point blankly, do you want to give your life to Jesus?

And his response was an affirmative yes.

And uh, you know, he talked about you know a feeling of loneliness, uh, a feeling of of being tired.

And I I know what that meant, you know, and so God used me as a mechanism of providing this young man in that moment justifying grace, you know, and then you get into the church and you and you talk about sanctifying graces.

Yes, we have the scriptures, we have prayer, we have worship, we have communion, but we also have small group, we have Christian community, we have holy conferencing, and all that is is is cooperating with God and helping spur people on toward love and good deeds.

So we need to think of this rather than grace being this one-time moment of conversion, we need to think of it more of a journey.

Yeah, grace is the grace is the ocean in which we swim in.

Right?

Yeah, I like that.

Yeah, you just you need grace.

Uh we are church of the lakes, we gotta do something with water here.

Yeah, we do.

I love that.

But yeah, you know, what do they say?

Um Jesus is not the ABCs of Christianity, he's the A2Z of Christianity.

Oh, yeah.

And Tim Keller said that.

Yeah, it's a beautiful statement, and it goes along also with the idea that we do grace is the the ocean we swim in.

It's it's not it's not a one and done thing.

It it it's what uh continues to revitalize us and refresh us and transform us.

We need God's grace.

We are saved by grace through faith, and not any work of in our own doing, Paul says in Ephesians.

In Ephesians, yeah.

Um, you know, Jared, that means that with this understanding of grace, it should really change the way we think about someone perhaps who's believed in Jesus for years, but is still struggling with things, struggling with their own brokenness, addiction, sin, doubt, um, or a lack of spiritual growth.

How how does this idea of grace feed into that then?

Yeah.

Um I think first we have to believe that as the Lord is doing this perfecting work in us, that we can actually be perfected, not in our own strength, but in cooperation with the Holy Spirit that now lives in us.

Like the Holy when the Holy Spirit came to live in us, not only did we go from death to life, but we also were given the ability through partnership with the Holy Spirit to become a perfected person.

Now that's distinctly Wesleyan to say that the road to perfection can be achieved through the Yeah, you know, Christian perfection would be the doctrine.

I mean, John Wesley, the founder of what uh Methodism, believed that a person could be perfected on this side of the grave on this side of the grave.

You know, and I I would say I believe that as well.

Uh entire sanctification is another term and theological term.

Okay.

Uh Phoebe Palmer was a historical figure in in uh Methodist circles back in the oh dear 18th, 19th century, who people would believe that she was entirely sanctified.

And so I think entirely entire sanctification is not a doctrine we should dismiss as is unimportant or is or unattainable.

Um I think with with the partnership with the whole the cooperating with the Holy Spirit and in the gift of grace, we can achieve that.

And like I said a moment ago, when we come to faith, we have been perfected, but we're also in the process of being perfected in cooperation with the Holy Spirit.

And so somebody who who's you know maybe has grown up in the church, has claimed to faith in Jesus Christ, but they haven't changed for the better in the course of 20, 30 years.

Not to be harsh, but I want to have a conversation over the the vibrancy of their faith.

Well, it's how are you engaging in the means of grace as you pursue Christian perfection?

Because if you're no better today than you were 30 years ago, you're not engaged, you're being too passive.

Okay.

You know, Eugene Peterson talks about a long steady obedience in the same direction.

Like every day has to be a even building on it on itself on itself, and we're becoming even more holy as days unfold.

I had a uh a chief engineer uh who used to say that there are um many different types of of people out there.

There are some people who have 20 years of experience, and then there's some people who have 20 first years of experience.

You mentioned that, uh and I know I'm repeating myself, but I'm that's great.

It's worth worth repeating.

Often to oftentimes in Christianity, we feel like, you know, we don't have to build on anything.

We're just repeating the process.

And that's not true.

We're supposed to build and grow, and that's why I'm excited about uh Church of the Lakes' vision and our strategy through our vision frame to build on these things.

Like last year we talked about the identity and the identity of Christ so that we know that we have an identity in him and him alone.

Yeah, and then we move to the kingdom conversation, yeah.

Literally here on this podcast, but more importantly through the word of Christ.

Yeah.

Uh and then next year we'll look towards leadership.

It's this growth step of knowing, building on each other over and over again.

Yeah, that's really good.

Um I I I'm I'm just kind of stuck on your I love your engineering illustration of well, it's so true because you have so many people who don't necessarily um learn from their quote unquote mistake, perhaps.

Or or we have people that are just impatient.

Yeah, or things like I mean, Mike Glenn, a pastor I used to listen to, really, really love Mike Glenn.

He's helped form me as a preacher, to be honest with you.

But he's retired.

He has retired.

Yeah, I was gonna say it's not like you stop listening to him.

I'd love it if Mike Glenn started listening to me.

No.

Uh I need to reconnect that relationship.

Um, but something he talked about was like everybody, you know, when they get into kindergarten, they want to graduate high school.

But you can't graduate high school until you first get through kindergarten, and then first grade, and then second grade, and then third grade.

And so um uh you know, you look at the progression of uh of holiness in a person's life, like we want to be here, but we can't get here until we pass the test here, and then here, and then here, and that's that growth in grace.

Um I think of the parable the talents, right?

Uh yes.

The consequence of faithful work was more work, but you couldn't get the more work until you f did the the first work and and was faithful in that.

And so it really is a long steady obedience in the same direction.

It's faithfully plodding along day after day, pursuing Christ, doing the things necessary to grow in that holiness, and then you look back and then that that's when you see the difference.

But if you're someone who says, Jared, I I'm not any different than I was twenty years ago, I I want to ask, well, how have you been pursuing the Lord?

Like you you can't tell me you've been praying and reading the scriptures or you've been, you know, engaged in Christian community because if you had been, you would have there would have been some marked marked change in in your your your um spiritual vitality over the course of those 20 years.

I mean it ebbs and flows.

There's moments you take two steps forward and one step back.

There's moments where you maybe you you fall back into a besetting sin that you need to bring back to the Lord.

Uh I'm not trying to be, you know, um dismissive or or or make those things unimportant.

I mean people struggles.

No, that's not what I'm hearing you say at all.

No, yeah.

People struggle, but we also you can't minimize sin as sin.

And we have to do the work necessary to come out from underneath that sin, not in our own strength, in the strength of the spirit that now lives in us.

Well, I hope people have enjoyed our conversation specifically on this chapter 11 about the witnesses, because oftentimes people can fixate um oftentimes on all the wrong things with the book of Revelation.

It is a gut punch, isn't it?

I mean, oftentimes there's things that evoke these emotions within us, including the witnesses being persecuted and killed, right?

And I would go, you know, trying to tie this back into Revelation, you know, going back to the witnesses, there are moments where we might end up screwing up our witness.

Yeah.

And I think where we can uh in the midst of a screw up or where we fall short, where we own it, ask for forgiveness and continue to to repent of sin and to get back on the horse is actually an incredible witness in those moments, even to the world around us.

I mean, some of the the accusations the world makes of those who are in the churches were a bunch of hypocrite hippoc hypocrites who are judgmental.

Well, yeah, I guess maybe you're right, you know.

Um but but I can own that and say that I'm still pursuing Christ.

Um, this is how I'm pursuing Christ, and this is how I'm trying to become perfected in love.

Uh and one reason I even pursue other people even in the midst of my own brokenness is because I believe in the grace of God.

The grace saves me, you know.

The power behind it.

Yeah.

Well, thank you so much for your time today, Jared, helping us dive a little bit deeper into this uh incredible study.

We've had incredible turnout in our small groups, had great attendance as we've gone through the book of Revelation.

If you're interested in finding out more, of course, uh stay tuned here on our podcast.

We're gonna be posting the sermons as they come out each week, and then as well as these conversations until we get to the end of the series as we provide insights on this book that hopefully um let you build upon your own life rather than just repeat the same day after day activities.

Uh but before we go, I just want to say once again a big thank you to Betsy, who's our director of communication.

Len Brown, our editor, our encourager, my wife Stephanie, our social media coordinator, and getting this podcast up and running.

If you'd love to reach out and submit a question, please send an email at podcast at church of the lakes.org.

We'd love to hear from you, hear your suggestions, or answer your question right here on air.

Uh but before we go, please remember it's our mission as followers and disciples of Jesus Christ to connect all to him, to become healthy in God and courageous in love.

And until next time, God bless.

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