Shifting Perspectives - Biblical Conversations about Topics that Matter - Episode 40

Welcome to Shifting Perspectives.

Biblical conversations about topics that

matter. Let's get to it.

Hey everybody, welcome back to Shifting

Perspectives. And um I think we've been

having a really good time just talking

about some questions rather than having

a theological topic. And we got another

one uh another one this week. Scott,

what's what's the question for this

week?

>> You know, and I'll before I get to the

question, I want to I want to encourage

everybody, you know, share these share

these videos with people that you may

know and also if you have questions if

something's weighing on your mind and if

it's not, talk to your talk to your your

older kids or your teenagers because

they often times will ask the questions

that we want to ask but be we're afraid

to ask and they're more than willing to.

So, um, you know, send us some of those

questions. Let us be a ministry to you

and your family as well because you

never know who's got the same question.

So, this week, interesting one. Um,

again, we talked about being a quicksand

last week was, you know, u with if if

God is good, wise evil, and and how we

struggle to get out of the quicksand

with that. This is another one of those

quicksand topics that sometimes we

struggle and feel ourselves getting a

little bit deeper in. But um is

Christianity

a religion or is it a relationship? Run

with that. Um wow. So um um the answer

is yes.

And like what what do you mean it's an

either or? It's a it's it's the question

the answer is yes. Um, I think a lot of

times people want to um want to reduce

down

um everything that we find in the

context of the Bible and and the

relationship in the New Testament church

and how things were were designed to be

to be done by God for a purpose and say,

"Well, really all it really boils down

to is is that I've accepted Jesus as my

savior and I have a personal

relationship with him." um that a and

there's there's a part of truth that is

there but it is a it is a partial truth.

Our our our faith you can't have faith

for me. No

>> um I can't have faith for you. My

parents could not have faith and give

that faith to me that would get me a

saving relationship with Jesus Christ.

That is 100% true. I have to make the

decision to make Jesus Lord of my life

myself. And no matter how much my

parents wanted that for me or how much I

want that for my children or how much

you want that for your children, they

have to make that decision. But a

relationship with Jesus Christ was an

entrance into something. Uh you know, so

I mean I'll give you an example. Jesus

in Matthew chapter 7 said um he he said,

Matthew 7 · chapter mention

"Enter by the narrow gate for the broad

broad gate um leads to destruction and

there are many who are on it. But the

narrow gate leads to life and there are

few that find it. But the few that find

it, guess what they're on? They're on a

road together.

>> Mhm.

>> Um and all throughout scripture we find

that the idea was

you became a part of something and that

something is a broader relationship that

is the religion of the New Testament

church. And that's that's that's

sometimes a hard concept for people to

understand because we don't like

religion. Religion sounds uh well, it

sounds legalistic. It sounds

>> um it sounds hierarchial and we don't

like hierarchy, right? And so um and and

we can expound on that a little bit

more, but what what are what are your

thoughts in in that? Um

>> well, I think it goes back to what you

said. I mean, the the religion versus

the relationship. um go back two weeks

ago when we talked about, you know,

submission and obey. I mean, that was

when we keyed off of that and that's

kind of what led into these last few

discussions is, you know, I can obey

God, but do I really submit? And to me,

the religion piece, the legalistic side

of it is what got, you know, the people

that that crucified Jesus, you know,

were the religious uppidity ups in in

the temple that should have known

better.

>> That's right. But they were not in

relationship with the word. Therefore,

they were they were blind. They were

looking for A and Christ came as B and

they could not see

>> that even though he didn't look like

what they want, didn't do what what they

wanted, he was still fulfilling

everything that they knew from their

heart. And I think that's where we get

into of, you know, the relationship to

us and God is, do I trust him? Can I

rely on him? Do I believe him? Do I

believe his word? Or do I doubt him?

because you know it doesn't take much

doubt before you find yourself skating

on extremely thin ice. However, it

doesn't take much faith to find that ice

being 6 foot thick and you know it's

rock solid and never going to let you

down. That's right.

>> So, for me, that's where it comes back

into, you know, the relationship piece

is God is not a God's not sitting there

waiting for you to mess up so that he

can crush you.

>> He's not waiting just to punish. He gets

no, he gets no joy. Clearly in

scripture, he gets no joy over the

punishment. Um, but just like a parent,

whenever your child disobys, you know,

sometimes you give them the grace and

sometimes you have to give them a

consequence.

>> That's right.

>> And you know, the consequences are there

um whether it's taking something away or

doing something, the consequences are

there to get them to understand that

that activity that they're doing is not

what they want. So back to the question,

you know, those are the differences for

me is I trust God as my heavenly father.

I trust God as who he is. I trust his

word. I trust him to guide my life even

in the bad times. And I like to

reference the book of Job. Um you know,

Job chapter 2, whenever his wife is kind

Job 2 · chapter mention

of kind of on him a little bit, um you

know, he said um I came naked into this

world and in this world I'll leave. I

you know, I've I've been God's given me

something and God's taken it away. It's

his to give, his to take. That's

submission. That's that's a

relationship,

>> right? And so, you know, if if we were

to bring that forward to today, you

could say that you could participate in

a religion. Pick one. Pick the religion

of your choice.

>> Um, and and you could even be one that

sits in the pews of a Protestant

evangelical church in America today.

whatever flavor you wanted, whether that

was Baptist, Methodist, Lutheran, uh you

know, Episcopalian, uh Assembly of God,

Pentecostal, pick one. You could go and

sit in that church and be in religion

and never have a relationship with Jesus

Christ.

>> Yeah.

>> And when you have a relationship with

Jesus Christ, see, this is the this is

this is the great dynamic. Um and and

and and you might have it said like

this. Um, I couldn't imagine sitting

here having a conversation with Scott if

Scott was ever to say to me, you know, I

I like you, um, but I don't like your

wife.

>> I mean, if Scott was ever to say that to

me, we would not be in a relationship.

Right.

>> Right.

>> The Bible says that the church, that

religious structure, the of the people

who are the believers who've given their

lives to Christ and are in a

relationship, um, they are the bride of

Christ. And could you imagine ever being

someone that says, "Hey, Jesus, I like

you." Um but I don't like your idea of

religion. Um and so there is a dynamic

and and we could talk about many

scriptures. You can look at Romans

Romans 12 · chapter mention

chapter 12. You can look at uh 1

1 Corinthians 12 · chapter mention

Corinthians chapter 12 that talk about

um though we are individuals, we are

members of the body of Christ together.

Um, and so even though we are

individuals, each one of us is needed in

that religion for it to be doing what

what what God intended for it to do here

on the earth. This is why you didn't

become a Christian and give your life to

Christ and get zapped out of here and

just go to heaven because there was more

to the story than that. You could um um

I mean you could even fast forward into

you know a couple other passages. 1

1 Peter 2 · chapter mention

Peter chapter 2. In 1 Peter chapter 2,

1 Peter 2 · chapter mention

it says says that we who are the

believers are living stones that are

being fitted together. So, you can't be

you can't have a relationship with Jesus

and just be off by yourself because

you're missing the rest of what the

Bible says. So, is is is is Christianity

a relationship or is it a religion? The

answer is yes. But you can have religion

and never have the relationship

>> and be lost and spend eternity separated

from God.

>> You can't have the relationship and

ignore the religion and that

relationship really be real, right?

>> Um because that's then in again you talk

about obedience versus submission.

That's literally in rebellion to what

God said because God said um if you are

going to be in relationship with Jesus

Christ you will be a part of his church.

Uh another great one Hebrews chapter 10

Hebrews 10 · chapter mention

25 um fail not the gathering of thyelves

together as some have become accustom.

Um in other words there were people in

that time that the writer of Hebrews saw

and said hey you all are you all are not

doing. Um and it's implicit in the

Bible. Well, that's what most people

understand. Find me the verses that say

you must go to church. Find me the

verses that say, you know, I I can't

find those. Do you know why I can't find

those? Because God was implicit in the

design of the New Testament church and

the relationship. And by the way, his

design, this is a plan. Um, you the

redemptive plan of God all the way back

before creation because God is

omnisient. He's all knowing. He already

knew the choice that you would make. He

already knew the choice that I would

make. He already knew the choice that

Scott would make. And he planned a

redemptive purpose that included his son

ultimately coming because there's no one

else that could carry the weight of the

sin except for the son of God. And so no

one else could do it. Um, and that's the

that's the whole idea that brought us

into this relationship was a plan that

also brought us into this religion.

>> Um, I I don't know how else to

>> how else to answer that.

>> You know, I think you I mean I think you

covered it all. Um, the only thing I

would add was, you know, the

understanding of the the the church, the

church body is, you know, if you walk in

for the first time into a church body,

we talked about this a few weeks ago,

and you look at the church body and say,

I walk into Corinth on a typical Sunday

and there's, you know, 60 to 70 people

here worshiping together. You realize

you're walking in, and this is where I

think people face the challenge, is

you're walking into a room full of 60 or

60 to 70 sinners.

And oftentimes you walk in as a first

time to a church and and I do this on

vacation. When we go on vacation, I

enjoy going to other churches, but I

walk in and I sit down by somebody. I

don't know if I'm sitting down by

another first time attendee or if I'm

sitting by, you know, the pastor's wife,

you know, I don't know who I'm sitting

down beside. And, you know, you got to

give them all the grace that God gave

us. So if you walk into Corinth, no,

you're going to find, you know, some

broken people. You're going to find some

sinful people. You're going to find some

people that aren't perfect that are

working on that sanctification process

as we go through the relationship with

Jesus Christ. And you know, understand

that becomes the family for your journey

as well because as I'm fighting my

battles, I've helped other people fight

their battles. And as other people have

fought their battles, they've helped me

fight my battles. And you know we all

come together in relationship to each

other and ultimately to Christ

horizontally and vertically.

>> Yeah. So ultimately at the end of the

day the answer is yes. Christianity is

both a relationship and a religion. And

you can have religion and not have a

relationship but you cannot have a

relationship and not have a religion

because you can't be a part of what God

has designed for you to be a part of.

>> Yep. Perfectly said. And with that,

we'll end this week's session and we

will see you guys next week for another

question. Have a good week. If you if

you have something on your mind, let us

know. Send us a comment. Bye-bye.