EP2: Why is Serving a Discipleship Issue?

Hey there, my name is Chris rivers and I want to thank you

for joining us for the grace church members podcast.

The goal of this resource is to address discipleship issues in

the life of Grace Church and discuss how to be more fully

devoted to God in this episode, Scott Mozingo.

And I chat with Leann cabin who serves as Grace Church has care,

and Recovery director, and executive housing director.

Be sure to check out our podcast page at Grace Church SC.

Org /y, discipleship on this page you can access a summary of

each episode and additional resources to help you move

towards discipleship. Okay, let's jump into this

episode. Well, Leanne, we're glad to have

you today and talking about why serving is a discipleship issue.

So, before we get started, watch tell us a little bit about your

role here. Thanks Chris, I'm been on staff

for about 11 12 years. I am currently in the role of

our care and Recovery Ministry director, that includes items

like Divorce, Care, grief, share region Mosaic.

And recently, housing, all that experience, is what we wanted to

tap into today when you and I were talking offline.

About issues that have shaped the culture of our church things

that are really meaningful that are easy also to take for

granted, but things that we can't afford to take for granted

because it is part of at the very core of who we are called

to be as a organization as a church as a local body.

There are a lot of things you could have talked about but the

first thing you jumped on as you said I want to talk about

serving and I'm so excited to have this conversation.

Let's do two things at the onset.

Just kind of Define what serving is and then tell us what role

serving is really played in your faith Journey To Me serving is

giving your life away. Now that could look many

different ways and so it could be a specific serving role.

But I think it's also an orientation of the heart and how

you go about life in general. I think serving has a vertical

and a horizontal component. So I serve because of what the

Lord has done for me and how Christ serve me.

First, but then serving requires another individual.

So yes, I could just serve myself.

So I guess it doesn't require it but to really be serving in a

way that Jesus modeled, there's someone else.

And so that is me serving, lifting up caring serving for

somebody else, my in my life down to care for others.

I think sometimes we have compartmentalised serving down

to a specific role or event, and I think that's where we get into

trouble. To me, it is much, Much broader

than a serving roll or this idea of I serve at church or I serve

on our swim team board. So I check the box or I have to

go do baseball concessions. This is part of how I serve at

little league and so this is what I do, but I think that idea

is very narrow and that's where we get into some trouble because

serving for me has been life-changing and life-altering.

Yeah, tell us a little bit about it's kind of growing up Church.

How you viewed serving how that changed over the years.

Growing up. We were always in church.

The door was open. We were there, but we were very

much consumer. It was something that we did.

And the discipline of going to church was always a part of

life, but in my life, I actually did not see the impacts of

Sunday and Wednesday. Beyond those events.

We did not have a, I would say, we have a Christian values home,

but we did not have a Christ following home.

And so that put some Discord and my experience, then when we got

married, Read. And after Mac was born, he was

six months old. We started looking for churches,

here in Greenville. The very first church we went to

was a very established church and it was great because I came

and I had my son to nurse you volunteer, and the same Nursery

volunteer handed him back to me after he had slept with her on

her shoulder and the rocking chair the entire service and I

was thrilled. As a young mom, that was all I

wanted. Then the next week we visited

Grace and at that point in time, there were 70, 80 people, we

came in, I had that Same sweet, six month old son, that nobody

else was really taking care of outside of family and we walked

in and Nursery was in a hallway. The nursery was not really what

we would call a nursery but it was a location, drop your kids.

And so we did and I was very uncomfortable.

I gave my son to a man which I had not done before and it

wasn't a very comfortable environment.

So we went to service or went to the worship service because my

husband told me we had to we laughed.

We left back there, we went in In heard teaching, like we had

never heard before and came back, I share that because right

after that, I got involved in serving in the nursery because I

wanted to know who had my kid, know that man was it was odd to

me? There was a big man taking my

kid and now he's still here. One of the sweet things that was

the Andersons. I was totally Anderson and still

serving at our church and has had my kids a couple different

times throughout children's ministry in their life.

So very grateful for him. But at the onset, I had no idea

who he was. Why he would be back there and

Else was going to be taken care, and it was obvious.

They needed us. So, West quickly got plugged

into the worship team. He was on drums within a couple

weeks at best, and I was serving on the rotation back in the

nursery and that hooked us, we were back and we would come back

week after week because we had a responsibility at that point.

It was more about being needed. Then really the motivation of

anything else. Is that I was needed.

I needed to feel that responsibility and so I would

Keep coming, and it brought us back into church and took us

away from college football games and weekend spent traveling the

team because we had a responsibility and we had

someplace to be and there were people on the other end of those

responsibilities that you were serving and caring.

For at that point, I didn't really care about them if I'm

honest. I mean I was just trying to make

sure I was doing what I was supposed to do and a high level

of responsibility and I did like being needed.

So at fed and idle it took me a while to actually learn to Care

people, I would serving. How did that?

How did that change for you? I think that came later probably

when I had more of a women's ministry role because I was

diving into scripture. In a new way as I said, I'd

grown up in church, it was something that we did, but it

didn't really impact our daily life.

I started serving with the women's ministry team really to

bring my organizational skill to the team and enjoyed that, but

they started the beatings with. With what is God teaching?

You what we all set in the same service on Sunday right now,

he's teaching us Ruth. What's the question?

It's like I didn't understand this idea of self feeding and

and being in the scriptures and expecting God to do something.

And so I had to start reading so that I'd have an answer the next

time, it came around and I Started Loving, really reading

scripture for myself, not just what I was being taught.

And then it started to make sense all the one another's.

Scripture caring for one another bearing one another's.

Burdens all of that came to life and I started caring about

visit. I was certain it was no longer

serving Yang, caring about began to understand that.

So I think that was the big piece for me that flipped a

switch. So I think that's so helpful,

thinking about how scripture comes alive when you're putting

it into application. It's basically what you're

talking about. Can you think about some other

scriptures that were really fundamental in changing your

view from that? Rotation towards that

orientation to others. As I studied prior, it was

really knowledge base. It's kind of flat because I

wasn't needing to apply it. And, as I started reading,

especially in the New Testament. When Paul's letters started to

make, a lot of sense to me in ways they had not prior.

When I specifically think of Colossians, there's a spot.

I think it's chapter, 1 verses, 28 and 29.

So we tell others about Christ. Warning, everyone in teaching,

everyone, with all the wisdom, God, Giving us, we want to

present them to God perfect in their relationship to Christ.

That is why I work and struggle so hard, depending on Christ,

Mighty power, that works within me and there was something about

that, that struck me as not only the motivation but also pulsing

is hard and it's struggle. I think so often when I was

recruited to serving roles or people are talking about it,

they were like, this is easy crumb, and all we need you to do

is to serve on this. Spot for an hour a week.

It'll be an easy thing to do. You can do this.

And what I found was denying myself going when I didn't want

to go. I spent seven years in the

nursery in the baby nursery. So when service would go long

and parents weren't picking up quickly because I had a

conversation after a long service, we might Temptation.

Would easily be come? Get this kid?

Yeah, right. I'm tired of your child's

crying. This is difficult and then

realizing know. It's supposed to be I'm caring

for this child, I'm caring for this family.

They need to connect and serving isn't the Christian life isn't

easy thinking about how many times we start a sentence with

all you need to do is and when we lead that way, we're really

cutting a big part of what God's intention is for serving, which

is to force us into self-denial as opposed to self-fulfillment.

And I think, your Story begins to Explain a real practical

example of how that works for a lot of us.

And I think we all start somewhere, right?

And so, we may start in a place that's easy or a spot that

really isn't motivated out of love, it.

Really is our own fulfillment. Hey, I'm really gifted in fill

the blank and so I really just racial.

Yeah. So I just want to do that.

Yeah but there might be a need somewhere else and being able to

recognize. Okay.

I actually need to meet this need I'm capable I may not.

Gifted. I may not find it easy.

I think often using our gifts which are for the body, it is

often easy. So to me, that's a difference in

serving serving is laying down my life for someone else, that's

not easy. I want to preserve my life.

I want to preserve my comfort. So I think when we are

recruiting, when we have a role, the worst thing to say is we

just need, I don't want the word just because if anyone can do it

then go find anyone. Leave me out of it.

I want an opportunity to do something unique.

Nique I want an opportunity to really be a part of something

bigger. And I think we all do were

created to be a part of something bigger.

And then I think the other thing that we do often is we don't

release and call people into serving, when we find our Niche

and we feel really good about what we're doing, we start to

find fulfillment in it and releasing and calling somebody

else to. It can be difficult.

And so, I think leaders make that mistake also and it robs

them of an opportunity, right? It's selfish to not invite

people in. And I think what you're touching

on there is the difference between discipleship, which is

where we are growing in, how we follow trust depend on Jesus and

become more like Jesus. And just fill the role of

quote-unquote volunteer, like, you talked about with the little

league or the PTA so we just plug in a roll.

Need a need and there's nothing really transcend about it.

It's a check box. But with serving we're talking

about something that is critical to our walk.

Walk with Christ critical to becoming fully formed into the

image of Christ. And so that's why we wanted to

talk about why this is such an important discipleship issue.

That grows your Devotion to god. Let's talk about thoughts on

why. Now, why this is such an

important topic for us as a church for us as a church.

There are two components that I think of initially one we are in

a place where God has given us a number of resources and it is

quite humbling. See there's a Temptation that it

comes with that that we can Outsource.

Especially we can Outsource the things that we don't like to do

that aren't as fulfilling give some examples of that.

For one to me is childcare, we have the ability to pay for

child care workers and I think that's great and we need it.

I remember being that young mom, but I think there's also an

opportunity for me now to be in a different season to go, you

know what I do, remember what that was?

Like, why don't I come serve and I'll cover so parents can go.

Go to re-engage and that we not Outsource and just pay for

everything that can be done or flipping rooms in between the

services or events. I still really enjoy the pack in

pack out. I haven't done it for a while so

I can enjoy something in reflection but there was

something to that side by side and I'd have conversations with

people, that would only happen in that environment because

we're both literally moving chairs ghetto.

And you get to just have a conversation that wouldn't

naturally. Drink up any other time.

I think the other thing about why now coming out of covid, it

has been really interesting to me to watch volunteer teams,

come back which teens come back quickly and which ones do not.

Hmm. And so I think it is revealed

and it's given us a gift of awareness that we did not have

prior. Many of us were just doing

routine. There's that just again, we were

working through because it was in our schedule, it wasn't

necessarily intentional. Well, I think we were guilty of

adjusting serving rolls to be easy to fit in schedules without

asking folks, to deny their own preferences as much.

It's one of the things that I think helped us grow so much was

really going. We can't be at every Carolina

game. We can't travel and do what we

need to do as our kids aged. There were times that we would

send Mac with another family to a baseball tournament because we

had the priority. Of being here.

And I think our family Grew From that.

I know we grew from that. And so as we come out of

covid-19, seeing serving roles that were easy to fit in your

schedule or also easy to leave out of your schedule.

And so if we were on a convenient rotation, a lot of

those volunteers didn't come back.

It wasn't purposeful. It wasn't something that was as

meaningful because it just kind of fit.

One of the things that I noticed, our Mosaic volunteers

were back. Back.

As soon as a doors open, I think they signed up to do something

that would be hard. I knew it, but they were bought

in. They wanted to be there.

They want to serve the families, they want to serve the

individual and they came back as soon as we open the doors.

So I think it has helped us reveal our own hearts and what

is our motivation for serving? Am I serving because I'm

supposed to or am I serving? Because I want to I serve

because this is what the Lord did for me.

So what's the danger of pursuing to It's comfort in a serving

role. When I think, when we start

finding comfort in these different roles, we exchange

that for Christ Comfort. Yes, let's talk about have to

have his comfort, right? Don't need it because this is

easy. It's the hardship that you have

to lean on him to say, I need your comfort because this is

difficult. I don't think all serving has to

be painful. I'm not trying to turn us into

these major Martyrs, but I think we have to prioritize it, it

needs to be an intentional part of our Life.

It needs to be sacrificial and it gives us that opportunity to

realize, oh I'm valuing myself over someone else.

I don't want to go today because it's raining I don't want to

stand outside the ring. I mean I love that our parking

team does all that they do in the rain.

I love that you know, I pull up and I'm like, okay I feel cared

for I feel seen, that's a great gift, which they could have

easily called out because of the rain.

And at the end of it, I think that that will be a time that

they look back and be able to see a way that they laid it

down. Somebody else, and I got here an

hour early to set up, we don't have an awful lot of

opportunities to lay it down, right?

And this is an entry gate, like you said, for something to go

from being very, static to very Dynamic from that Outlook that's

oriented towards the self to an Outlook oriented to others and

it doesn't happen right away. But you got to get started, you

got to get involved and it can change over time and you can

have a lot of motivation and heart change.

Over time, but you got to get involved, you got to get going

in order to make that happen and learn what you're good at.

Right. That's right.

I had no idea. There were some things that I

actually could do. I started entering an Excel

because that's what I like to do and so that was something easy I

started with the nursery because there was a need but I've

learned through these different opportunities and serving roles

and feedback being given from others, that I do, have some

other ways to serve and to give. And so I've learned stuff about

myself. That that I would not have

learned, otherwise it would have been an opportunity and that's

one reason why we want to have a multi congregation model is

because when you split things off and make things smaller, and

make things more local, you need more hands, you need more

people. You need folks, doing things

that they're not as familiar with or they don't know how to

do and serving one another go back to those one another's like

talked about in the context of the local church for a

Transcendent purpose is a great place to do.

Do that. Let's talk a little bit about

the tension between serving and leading and where does our

leadership need to have these serving principles?

Always baked into them the different serving opportunities.

Bring out different skills in your guests and that's when I

would have never thought I had any leadership, I really prefer

the background. I always wanted food at events

because it gave me something to talk to the next person I'm out

because I'm not really good at stirring conversation.

So serving helps give those opportunities and you often

overtime begin leading. So if you've done something for

a long time, you end up having more responsibility, you end up

leading. I think if our leaders look at

leading as a end itself, I'm a leader.

Now I don't serve at lead. That's a poor Outlook because

again you're back to yourself in this accomplished spot.

Yeah, a good leader. He serves others.

Any power that we have should be power for others.

Good, not our own. And so I think in these

different roles where we are leading, we need to have an

orientation to serve those. That we are leading to care for

them to live out those one another's and to make sure that

we are also sacrificing for some of us leading is sacrificing,

right? It's not something we even enjoy

doing by any means. It's not an end.

It's Didn't it? Yeah.

And so that's the piece of that self-reflection and allowing the

Holy Spirit to go. Okay, again, you're sliding into

Comfort. You're good at this.

This is easy. You need to go do something

else. Our leaders need to recognize.

Are they modeling or are we prescribing?

So if I'm saying, this is what a spiritual life, looks like, this

is what you should do. Scripture says follow me as I

follow Christ, so it should be me doing all of these things.

And if I'm leading you in, Some way it's being modeled for you,

it's not being prescribed. And so I think the other thing

for our staff, as we are charged with leading industries that we

remember first, we are serving the lord not filling boxes but

if we start looking at our members as ways to complete our

ministry or they'll boxes have whole, here is a recruiting to a

whole is a terrible, right? Because again, you've missed the

Art of serving you've missed the discipleship opportunity can

meet with that person, find out what they are good at, find out

what they're passionate about, find out their weaknesses.

Sometimes you actually want to use their weeks and say, hey

this is a spot that we can grow. Let's try this, you know?

And I'll walk with you. Let's do this.

And so it's not a matter of just filling boxes and making things

happen but it's drawing people closer to Christ.

Yeah, they're serving. Yeah, placing people in roles is

very different than developing. Being them to be more devoted

followers of Jesus silently. And one is definitely easier

than the other but it goes back to do.

I have a posture, you're very definition of serving a, my

humble before God and am I serving him?

Because of what he's done in my life and because of that, I have

an obedience have an obligation to love and serve others.

And the way that I do that is actually through serving, not

for my own self fulfillment, for the good of others, for the

glory of God, and for the building, If this Kingdom and

it's just so interesting to me how we take good things and we

turned them and can corrupt them, which is this the story of

creation. Yeah and so I love that idea.

Behind are we modeling or are we prescribing?

This has been greatly and is there anything else that you

would want to add as we close? I think, if we look to see the

way Jesus served, it's really hard to look at the cross and

then say That doesn't fit, I can't do that this week because

we have this event going on. You laid it down and I don't

think we will get to the end of life and regret serving.

Another person that's been a pushback that we've experienced

with kids growing up and having events and understanding the

busyness of life. I just travel ball and all those

things but I know that that formed our family, it also

formed our kids getting in the car and said, hey, you gotta be

ready to go and you Being late is now impacting.

All of these people. This isn't just about you, get

your shoes on. Let's go and both by God's

grace, both of our kids are here and they're serving, they don't

despise the church and I'm so grateful for that.

But I think they, they learned the value of the church.

They learned the community that is there for them through

serving and being a part. So good, thank you so much for

sharing and being here with us. I've gotten a lot of advice.

This. So we shed it.

Absolutely. Thanks for having me.

Well, as we wrap up today's conversation, we want to thank

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