Ep. 6 - Are You Really Free?

Well, welcome back to the It's Life podcast for conversations about faith, meet real life, and heading into Father's Day.

Uh, there's probably nothing more faith and real life oriented than a conversation about parenting and fatherhood.

And so excited to dive in today.

But I want to tell you real quick before we dive in, uh, we love when you go on the journey with us.

So like, subscribe, uh, watch these, comment on these, and a lot of times we'll do little giveaways.

So here's a little teaser at the end of this, Dad.

We're gonna be doing a Bass Pro Shops gift card.

So we'll give you more details at the end of this, but yeah, you can't beat that.

So uh we have uh Patrick Grant with us, and Patrick Grant, we have you here because uh you're not just a father, but you're a grandfather, and so uh you probably know a thing or two because you've seen a thing or two.

So excited to kind of unpack some of this conversation with you.

That's a big thing.

I didn't say that.

I didn't say that.

Um but I want to start here because one of my favorite things from social media, oh man, this is back in uh May now, was the story that Miss Tammy told about Taylor at the top of the slide on the program.

So uh give us like a fun story about uh fatherhood for you, especially with four.

There's gotta be a good one in there somewhere.

I'd love to hear it.

Yeah.

Wow.

Well hope hopefully we'll get uh to several in this uh this time.

But um, you know, one that involves all of them is we'd like to do things together.

You know, so we would go camping, you know, we went to the lake a lot, you know, we went boating, skiing, tubing, snow skiing.

You know, we were always doing something.

Well, um on our 15th anniversary at the church in Arkansas, they sent us to Grand Cayman.

So we all went diving and we all got certified together.

Okay, that's cool.

So um we get there, we've had a great time, but we have no equipment.

So, you know, the next best thing to have in a truck is having a friend that has a truck.

Yeah.

Or next best thing to have in a boat is having a friend who has a boat, right?

So I borrowed all this diving equipment from a friend.

Oh gosh.

And we packed it in this hard shell um suitcase, and I got got it in there and it wasn't a problem.

But when we got ready to come back, I packed it the same way.

And why is it?

You know, you could get it there, but you can never get it back home.

And so we could not get the thing to shut.

So I'm sitting on it, you know, I get Miss Tammy, I get the kids, we're all sitting on it to get it closed, and then I put one of those travel bands on it.

Okay.

And uh anyway, we we get up there to uh go back, and this is uh right be you know, it's before 9-11, and and so you didn't have the security measures that you have right now.

So they were asking people at Grand Cayman to take the suitcase and put it up on a table and open it up and they would go through it.

And I'm looking at it thinking, it took all of us to get these clothes.

You know, there's no way that um we're gonna get up there and and open this thing.

So anyway, we're standing, it's me and Tammy and all the kids, and uh I I forget how old Taylor was, but he, you know, he's he's probably 15 or so.

And and we get up there and I look at the lady and I said, Now, ma'am, before you open this, I just need to tell you, when you open it, it's gonna explode.

Well, that's not the thing to say at the airport.

And then I looked there and I said, No, no, no, no.

I tried to recover.

I said, that's not what I meant.

What I meant was uh when you open it, everything inside is gonna go boom.

Golly, just doubling down.

Doubling down.

And Taylor is standing right next to his mom behind me, and he said, He's an idiot.

And at that moment, I agreed with him totally.

Uh so I'm just grateful to be here, not be in some you know, jail cell down in uh the island in the Caribbean.

But I think your saving grace was it was pre-9-11.

That's right.

It was right before 9-11, so we we made it out.

Yeah, that's great.

I love that.

But I think I do think that there's a uh a lesson in the story.

Uh I tried to pack too much in that one suitcase.

And as a dad, if you're not careful, you pack too much in your schedule and too much in a day in a week.

And uh, you know, i i it's a good takeaway to remember, you know, there's the to-do list and there's the must-do list.

Yeah.

And so so every day I'm looking at not just, you know, what do I need to do, but on that list, what are the two or three things that, man, today, it'll be success.

It'll be a productive day if I just do those two or three things.

That's good.

Um let me kind of pivot.

You know, we have an outline here, but I I love that.

Uh one, it's a classic dad story.

I feel like, you know, how many times have I or have you you ratchet strap something down and you give it a couple pats?

That's not going anywhere, right?

Uh that's like one of those stories.

But how do I find the line?

Okay, you just said there are things you you feel like you gotta do, and there are things you actually have to do.

How do you know as a dad or or husband, this is the these are the not just urgent things, but the most important things?

Sure.

Um, you know, great question.

I I I am constantly living off of a uh sticky note or a list.

I'm a list guy, to-do list every day.

You know, I'm gonna get up and pray, every day I'm gonna read my Bible, and every day I'm going to write down all that I know I have to do and get done.

And and usually it's more than you can get done in a day's time.

So then you take the to-do list and you turn it into must-do.

Okay, if I don't do anything else today, here's the two or three things that I've got to do.

And uh, you know, you you just you have to prioritize and live that way.

If not, you know, you may do a lot of things, but it won't be the most important thing.

Yeah, right.

And then you're always behind, and then you know, you're you're always frustrated.

Uh so yeah, that I personally have to write it down.

Uh it's good.

It's good.

That's the kind of stuff I think, you know, we say this is where conversations about faith meet real life, and and in a setting like this, you get an opportunity to kind of go a little deeper on some of this conversation.

So I'm excited to hear some of this.

As a dad, uh, and and maybe granddad, I want to get ahead, but as a dad, you have a lot of dads listening to this.

Father's Day is coming up.

So uh what is one thing, if you could say, hey, dads out there, whether you're a single dad, whether you're a married dad, uh, whether you're a granddad, this is the number one thing I would tell you is probably the most important thing in fatherhood.

What would be the one thing you would share with dads?

Well, first of all, you've got to understand that Father's Day will never rank anywhere close to Mother's Day.

Okay.

So just get over it.

Um, the other thing I would say is this, you know, guys are kind of like uh a pickup truck.

We we do better when we are carrying the load.

You know, pickup trucks when it's not loaded, man, it's it's just kind of bouncing all over the road, you know.

So it it's okay for you to have more on your plate than you can do.

It's okay for you to feel the weight of being a dad, of being a husband, of whatever it is that you know your vocation is.

I I think God made men that way and uh keeps us out of a lot of trouble.

Yeah.

And um there's that fine line between um, okay, I'm bored to death, so you get in trouble, or I am so overloaded and stressed out, I just I I I just need a few minutes, you know, of pleasure and and and a release.

And I just need, you know, and I think that you look at David in his life, he's bored as king, he gets in trouble, and um, you know, and you look at world leaders uh the same way.

Uh so as a dad, I'm just saying it's okay to be loaded down.

And and it's okay to feel that stress and that weight.

Knowing that, you said, what's the one thing that's most important?

Number one, yeah.

I can tell you, number one, I am going to start my day with God.

That's good.

You know, so I get up every morning, I make coffee, while it's making, I'm over there, I get on my knees.

Uh it's not a long prayer time, but I mean, I I just thank God for the day.

I thank God uh, you know, for every day he gives me, it's a gift.

And I ask him to speak to me through his word.

And uh and then I get in the word.

And whether it's a a devotional, whether it's a one-year Bible, whatever it is, um, you know, it's not so important as what tool you're using, it's just that you get in the word.

Yeah.

And so I'm gonna read through a one-year Bible.

We've been doing that since um probably uh the late 80s.

And uh, and then you know, out of that, um I'm I'm gonna pray for my wife.

So so after I finish reading the scripture, that's when I'm gonna close again in prayer, and I'm gonna do two things.

I'm gonna pray for my wife, I'm gonna pray for my my children, grandchildren.

I pray for this church family, obviously.

You you said, you know, you're the dad or father of this this uh uh congregation, and certainly I pray for for all of our people.

Um so so that's just important.

You know, that if it's the one thing, first thing you you start every day the same way.

Doesn't matter how early I have to get up to start.

I'm gonna spend time with the Lord.

I'm gonna pray.

And um and and talking about prayer, here's you know, I pray, thanking God for my wife, uh and I ask God to help me honor her, value her as the gift she is from God.

And then I'm gonna pray for uh my kids and grandchildren three things.

Favor.

Okay.

Pray favor.

Uh, you know, Daniel had favor uh on him, uh, even in in uh, you know, an enemy territory taken away and Babylon, uh he had the favor of God.

Joseph had the favor of God on him in either.

So I'm listening, right, and and I'm hearing you say, hey, pray favor over your kids and your grandkids.

Uh for the guy who is unfamiliar with church, they're unfamiliar with the word favor.

Sure.

What does that look like?

Practically like how do I pray favor over my kids and my grandkids?

Yeah, great question.

You know, uh the favor of God, it another word would be blessing.

You know, you you want something that is outside of yourself.

So you you need the favor of God.

He opens doors that no man can shut, he shuts doors that no man can open.

And so that's the that's what I mean by favor.

That that that God would uh the Bible says about Daniel, he distinguished himself.

So you want your kids to be distinguished.

Yeah.

You know, and what I mean by that is they have the favor of God, that he's going before them, that he's opening doors, that he's fighting their battles.

Uh so I pray for favor, and uh, and and I pray not only that, but I pray for their friends.

In other words, bring the right people in their life and take the wrong ones out.

Get them out, yep.

Yeah, and then ultimately fear the Lord.

That they they'll fear God, not man.

It you know, if you pray those three things for your kids and grandkids every day, and you're treasuring, honoring your wife, it's the gift that she is.

Man, that that's that's the way that a dad, a father should pray every day.

I love that.

That's incredible.

Uh it reminds me, maybe it was a conference we were at together, um, there was a statement that was made, and it has been my prayer over my kids ever since I heard it.

And uh we pray for our kids every night, and uh when I pray, my prayer is God, go get my kid, I want you to save them.

There's a Holy Spirit moment here that has to happen.

Uh I can teach them everything I can know to teach them, but it's gotta be you.

Uh and then God, would their uh floor be my ceiling?

Would they go further than anything I've ever done?

Would they see more of you than I've ever seen?

And would they experience more than I've ever experienced?

And uh I think those three things kind of embody that.

Like I want them to experience you more uh thanks to the people.

Yeah, because if it's just behavior modification, that's all external.

You know, but what you want is something internal, you know, God focuses on the heart.

Yeah.

And so ultimately, uh you want them to be more than a little Pharisee.

And a little Pharisee, somebody that you know, they they're they're keeping the rules externally, but in in inwardly they don't know God.

Yeah.

And so ultimately it's got to become personal to them and and pray that they'll love God with all their heart, soul, mind, and strength.

Yeah, I love that.

And we're gonna I'm gonna a little bit later on, I'm gonna ask you more about that.

Like what are some of the ways that you did that?

But uh you mentioned the one thing, and I love that it's starting on your face every day.

Uh it's those three things that you're praying over specifically.

Uh, but now you're still a dad, you don't ever stop being a dad, right?

Uh but you're just in a different season of fatherhood.

And so uh there are probably a lot of people listening to this that are in that season where I now have grandkids and my kids aren't in my home anymore.

Uh, what is God still teaching you about fatherhood even in this season?

Wow.

Um, you know, none of us have arrived.

So when you have adult children now, it's uh it's a matter of I'm learning from them, you know, uh they're challenging me.

Uh and and be careful what you do because ma I remember I took uh Taylor when he was really small to uh Disney and took him to to Space Mountain and all the way up, you know, he's not wanting to ride.

And we get up there and some little teenage girl looks at us and says, He doesn't have to ride.

I said, Oh yes, he does.

And we got on it and he he wrote it and he loved it afterwards.

Okay, but it'll come back to haunt you because I was probably in my fifties, we're at Busch Gardens, and there's the roller coaster that you know just hangs.

And uh and so he said, Come on, Dad, all of us, all the guys, we're gonna go ride it.

And I said, That's okay, y'all can do it.

He said, Oh no, do you remember Space Mountain?

And so it'll come back, you know.

But uh, but no, they they challenge you and you're learning from them, and then it's really neat watching them with their children.

And and uh, you know, uh parenting's hard.

And uh and just like I could see myself and my kids, um they see themselves and their kids.

And sometimes when their kids are acting just like they used to act, I take great satisfaction.

Yeah, you know, I mean it back twofold, man.

Yeah, yeah, I love that.

That's great.

Uh it's interesting, right?

And uh I I've heard this said, you end up being a parent to your kids more in their adulthood than you do in their adolescence.

And so uh what are some unique challenges you face with that?

Or what are some things you glean from that?

Like, man, I I've raised this kid up, now they're out on their own, uh, and you have four, right?

Uh three boys and a girl.

Uh what are some ways that you've seen your parenting in their adolescence kind of leak into their adulthood?

Okay.

Um well, let's talk about their adolescence first, then, okay, before we get to there.

Um but you know, I think about every one of them.

Uh Taylor, for example.

Um I I remember um, you know, a couple of times that just really stand out.

One time he was with his friends on the weekend, and uh they they went to this bowling alley on the wrong side of town.

Okay.

And the guys that he went with and the the dad, you know, uh they're all drinking and it's getting out of hand.

And he called me and he said, uh, hey dad, I need if you come pick me up.

And I said, Where are you?

Every father probably wants their kid to feel comfortable enough to do that, Dad.

I'm in an environment I don't want to be in, I've gotten to a place I don't want to be, and they still feel comfortable enough to pick up the phone and say, Hey.

You know, he called and said, Hey Dad, um, I need you to pick me up.

And so uh, you know, I I I immediately just said, Tell me where you are, I'll be right there.

I went, I picked him up.

And um you know, I remembered on the ride back home, I asked him how he ended up there, but I I wasn't upset and I wasn't getting on to him.

I was just very grateful he called me to get out of a bad situation.

Another story, um uh uh he and Lindsay Beth uh were uh their senior year in band and they went on their band trip and uh Corpus Christi uh Texas.

Okay.

And so we're right there on the beach and we're in this high rise, you know, and um I'm I'm one of the chaperons, Tammy and I, and so we we are in our room and and the phone rings.

And uh it's in the middle of the night.

And he said, Hey dad, he said, get over here, there's a girl in my room.

And he hung up.

I'm like, What?

And and you know, Taylor is a lot like his dad.

He likes to have fun, full jokes, and I'm I'm I thought it was a prank.

And so I called him back and I said, What?

He said, There's a girl, she just came through my window, said you need to get in here.

He hung up.

I get up, I slowly get dressed, and Tammy says, Um, who was it?

I said, Taylor, what do you want?

He said, Some girls come in this bedroom window.

She said, You get over there right now.

If Lindsay Beth had called and said a boy came in the window, you would already be there.

That's a good word.

And so um, sure enough, I get there, and there's seven guys in that room, that you know, uh like three rooms on a condo.

And uh I said, now tell me this story again, because she's standing there in front of me, and all the guys are around her.

And um he said, Dad, I sound asleep.

And he said, I heard something in a sliding glass door, and I look and she's at the foot of my bed.

He said, I hollered and I said, Caleb, get over here.

There's a girl at the foot of my bed.

My goodness gracious.

And Caleb said, Taylor, go back to sleep.

You're you're dreaming.

And so uh he couldn't get anybody to believe him.

And so he jumped up and ran to get Caleb.

When he came back, the girl was gone, she was hiding in the closet.

And and long story short, uh, her mom had rented the the um um condo, you know, right next to them.

She came out like a balcony or something.

And and it was prom night.

And her and her friends were partying and it got at hand and the police came.

She went out on her balcony, there's nowhere to go.

She jumped from her balcony to my son's balcony, came in the sliding glass door, and said, Well, can I just stay here till the police gone?

Well, she was drunk.

And um, and so anyway, by that time Miss Tammy got there, and and Miss Tammy said, No, you cannot stay until the police leaves, and she uh took her out to the police and and um the guys were all around her, seven guys say, Can we at least have our picture made with her?

Um But again, in both of those stories, he called me when he when he needed me.

He called me rather than I mean how many guys would say, Hey, there's a young girl at the foot of my bed, and the last thing they're thinking about is calling dad.

You know, so I just think uh, you know, it's a story that really teaches that truth that you always want to be where they can call you anytime, anywhere, any place and say, you know, I need help.

Yeah.

Um, you know, that's Taylor.

I think about Lindsay Beth, um, you know, Lindsay Beth had no fear, and she, you know, she she's in college and she jumped off a bridge, you know, into a river, and that's another story.

But I'm just saying she had no fear.

And so um she always wanted to go and and parasail, you know, you're at the beach, you're watching it, and man, I'm afraid of heights.

Yeah, I don't know.

I just I'm thinking, I'm not doing it.

Jesus said low, I'll be with you always.

I love it.

Amen to that, brother.

So um I've been reading this father-daughter book all week long, and it talked about making memories.

And uh so by the end of the week, last day of vacation, Panama City, Florida, I said, All right, girl, let's go.

I was I did not want to do it.

And uh we got out there, the guys um driving, it was the end of the day, they were drunk, coolers empty, and you know, you had to pay for how far you would go up.

Interesting.

And more money to go higher?

Yeah.

Yeah.

So but these guys driving the boat were high as a kite.

So uh they said after we got up, hey, we're gonna give you the full amount, you know, for the low price.

And uh feed the low price on purpose.

So man, uh it it was a trip, you know.

But once we got up there, it it was incredible.

I mean, I can't wait for the rapture.

I remember thinking that this is gonna be awesome.

And uh, and you know, they they slow it down until your feet hit the water and then they take off again.

But it was a memory.

And there there's some connection with a father and daughter that is so special throughout life that um it's just different.

That's all I can say.

It's just different.

Um and and so uh uh again, you know, before before I came in uh to do the podcast today, uh she called me.

And uh Taylor calls me on the way to work, he calls me at lunchtime, and he'll call me on the way home from work.

So you're you ask the question, you know, uh from adolescence to adulthood.

You know, the great thing now is uh more than being their dad, I'm their friend.

Yeah.

Now when you're when you're the parent and they're young, you you're not always gonna be their friend.

Right.

You know, you need to be their parent.

Yeah.

Um but the good news is if the relationship's there, not just rules, but the relationship, then the day's gonna come that you're not just gonna be their parent, you're gonna be their friend.

Yeah.

And um and then uh the twins, you know, Zachary and Daniel are twins.

A lot of people don't know that, but they are.

And and so um, you know, I think about Zach.

Zach, it's almost midnight, and I get a phone call from a state trooper.

Oh gosh.

And he said, This is state trooper so-and-so, and and uh uh I'm here with a Zach Etheridge, and he gave me your number, and uh he said, you know, I want to talk to his dad, are you his dad?

And I said, No.

You know, at that point, you're like whoa.

Uh but seriously, you know, it's it it's late at night, you're worried.

I said, Yeah, is he all right?

And he said, Yeah, he's fine.

He said, Um, he he's driving home and and he's speeding on the James River Bridge.

And he said, I pulled him over and I told him, uh, you know, I asked him why you're speeding.

He said, Well, we're leaving really early in the morning to go to Georgia for my great grandmother's funeral.

And my dad said I had to be home by a certain time.

And and the trooper said, He's telling.

Me a story, I want to know if it's true or not.

And I said, Well, it really is.

We we're leaving early in the morning.

And um he gave him a warning and did not give him a ticket.

Wow.

Now I I want you to know, every time I get pulled over, I get a ticket.

I mean, I never get a warning, but Zach got a warning, and um, you know, that that stands out.

I remember I would I would teach them responsibility by you know, go out in the yard and cut a square with a riding lawnmower.

Then I tell them, just cut cut the square.

Right.

But you know, you have to have enough weight to hold down the seat.

So when they didn't weigh enough to hold down the seat, I'd put a big phone book, because they used to have phone books back then, you know, up under them to hold it down.

And uh I tell him a little bit, I see the lawnmower run into the tree, you know, and stopped.

And he's nowhere to be found.

He's out playing basketball.

And I said, Zach, what happened?

He said, Well, I was I was cutting that square, and he said, I didn't I didn't turn quick enough and I ran into the tree, so I just jumped off of it, it stopped, and I went to play basketball.

That's why.

You know, uh same same time he he he was making those turns and and didn't turn fast enough and ran over one of Miss Tammy's you know bushes.

And um, but but they're gonna make mistakes.

Sure.

They're gonna mess up.

You you want it to be where they can call you anytime.

You know, I th uh I I think about uh this this a serious story about Zach.

Um one Sunday morning early, I'm getting ready to leave, and he's already dressed, he's got on a suit, he's in high school, he's a senior, and I thought, why are you going to church so early?

He said, I'm teaching the oldest lady Sunday school class.

And I said, Why?

And he said, Because they asked me.

And I said, Well, talk after church.

So after church, I said, Zach, what in the world did you say?

Because between services, these older ladies were coming up, saying, Man, you know, that was so moving, and they're crying.

And I thought, what did he say?

And he said, Um, I I I prayed about what do we have in common.

And he said, I'm a senior in high school and they're senior adult, so I talked on senioritis.

Okay, all right.

I said, What did you say?

He said, Well, I told him, you know, I'm a senior and I'm tired of going to school, I'm tired of taking tests, but if but if I don't keep going, I won't finish well.

And I know as a senior adult, there are times you're you're tired of the test of life and you're tired of going on from day to day and it's not easy.

Um but if you don't, you won't finish well.

And I thought, wow, you know, what what a great lesson.

Yeah.

And so again, I'm learning from them.

You know, they're teaching me now.

Uh when I think about Daniel, um, even when he was little, I mean really little, every day he was preparing in the garage, putting stuff together, painting, cutting out cardboard, you know, he was getting ready for family worship, and we were gonna act out some Bible story.

That's cool.

And so he'd work all day long, and he'd have, you know, it could be um curtains, it could be ladders, it would be whatever.

And we would always act it out, and then we would laugh because he's Jesus riding in on Palm Sunday on the donkey and Taylor's the donkey, you know.

Um he's got them all the story of Joseph one time, and he's gonna do the big reveal, I am Joseph, and and of course they all had to bow down to him, you know, and so we just laughed.

Uh but now, uh watching him through the years, um, I can't remember a time that we didn't do ministry together.

You know, he's always we came here on the very first Sunday, he said, Dad, here's the bulletin.

He said, Now uh I've gotten on the computer and redesigned it, here's what it needs to look like.

Yeah, it's good.

You know, he's an eighth grader.

Yeah.

Um I think about the the the biggest uh to build a worship center was Greater Things.

And he'd been to um youth camp and he came in.

And um, you know, he's a high school student.

He said, Dad, listen, there's a brand new song out called Greater Things, and that's going to be the theme, your theme to build the new worship center.

And I mean, there's never been a time that he wasn't constantly thinking with me about ministry.

That's cool.

And uh, and and and so it's just so neat to see, you know, you're you're going through watching them grow up and you're trying to help guide and navigate them.

And now, uh more than just being their parent, you know, we're friends and we're doing ministry together, and so it's awesome.

That's incredible.

Um, you said a couple things in there, those are four phenomenal stories, maybe five.

Uh you made a comment uh, I think when you were telling the story about Lindsay Beth.

It's about not just the rules, but the relationship.

And you had started reading a book uh throughout this vacation time on like, man, how do I how do I connect with my daughter, or something along those lines?

I'm a dad, and I'm trying to figure out where the line is between rules and relationship.

And I think some parents get it really wrong on either end of the spectrum.

Some parents, there is no relationship, it's just all rules.

Some parents, it's too much relationship, and there is no rules.

Uh how do you find that sweet spot or what are some things, not that this is going to be an exhaustive conversation, but what are some things that along the way you've been like, hey, these are things I'm paying attention to to keep the relationship going while also having to establish rules?

Sure.

Well, uh, you have to understand, especially with a teenage girl, you know, she she thinks emotionally.

All right.

And and and as a dad, you're just thinking facts.

Yeah, yeah, sure.

Logic.

Right.

You know, so those two don't connect.

And and so um in those moments, you know, you you've got to have uh emotional equity to to be able, uh like an emotional IQ, you know, right, to be able to say, okay, I'm taking an emotion out of just because she's upset and yelling doesn't mean you're gonna be upset and yelling.

You know, you you've gotta try to understand where she's coming from and then help her to make the connection of what are are the real issues and and shit that you're dealing with.

So, you know, I I just think a lot of times, you know, parents are never gonna connect when when the kid is it's all emotional and it's about middle school girls or whatever, and and you're down here, well, here are the facts.

You know, you got two more years and then you you're away from them and you don't ever have to see them again, you know.

Right, right.

You're moving to another school or whatever.

Uh just helping them walk through that and see it.

Um as far as relationship and rules, you know, I think about um, man, uh, you know, we used we used Dobson's book uh that he wrote in the 70s, he rewrote in '92, Dare to Discipline.

And um, you know, a lot of Christian authors since then have have built on that foundation, but but it's based on the ABC's.

You know, A is authority.

They've got to have somebody who's the authority figure in their life.

That's good.

Um, who is helping them with their attitude and actions.

Right.

You know.

B, there's gotta be boundaries.

You know, you can't keep them fenced in in a stall, uh, but you can't just let them roam free.

Yeah.

So you've got to build some fences and give them latitude to move within it, those boundaries.

You know, ABC, and it sees consequences.

Yeah.

Every choice has a consequence.

And and you want to be a positive one.

I want to reward you and bless you when you make the right choice.

And when you don't make the right choice, obviously there are gonna be some negative uh uh consequences or punishments, you know.

You're gonna lose the phone, you're gonna be grounded this weekend, you know.

Um so uh yeah, I I think that you you you ask that rules versus relationships, you know, I think that you just have to keep those ABCs in mind.

And um and and ultimately, you know, uh I think it was the book uh How to Be a Hero to Your Your Kid, okay, that I that I read years ago, and and it just talked about um, you know, it it's one thing to accept your child unconditionally, love them unconditionally.

But that's not always approval of their you know actions and what they've done.

And and and so you can't compromise on certain things because if you do, they've got no one to come home to.

You know, that in the in the story of the prodigal son, dad didn't run after the prodigal.

He let him go and he reaped the consequences, and you know what?

He had a dad to come back home to who was there with open arms to love him and receive him.

Yeah, that's so good.

So much of that and uh and the three things you're praying over your kids and grandkids, uh, it's modeled by Jesus, right?

Uh those whom I love, I reprove and discipline, and then there's this relationship, but also I know what's best for you.

So I think it's a cool parallel there, right?

Like we we parent our kids based on how the father's watching over us, and and these are rules and and uh I guess ways of life that have been established in creation order.

So just some neat parallels there.

And I I love those ABCs.

I think uh sometimes those timeless things kind of get lost in the shuffle.

So uh as you know, parents my age are are coming up and trying to figure this whole thing out, those are like phenomenal uh ways to think about parenting and and maybe some baselines to set up.

So I I really appreciate that.

I love that.

Um now because they're in their adulthood, uh, and you you mentioned this a little bit, uh they have kids, and those kids are now your grandkids.

And so uh talk to me a little bit about that.

What what is there uh in that grandkid relationship that you're sitting back and you're enjoying and you're appreciating?

And I know we talked about some of that ROI, like you're getting it back.

Uh what are some other things there as a grandparent that you're really enjoying in the season?

You know, you you've heard it said many times.

You know, if you knew being a grandparent would was this much fun, you'd had your grandchildren first, you know.

And uh and of course I'm G-Daddy and I love being G Daddy uh to my grandkids.

But uh, you know, it it's a fun time, fun season, spending time with them, doing things as a family.

So we we try to set aside some uh time on the calendar when we're all together, and it's chaos, it's organized chaos.

Uh you get 22 people together, it's organized chaos.

23 counting uh Tammy's mama, she's there with us.

So um, and then throw Dexter in.

Yeah, can't forget Dexter.

So uh Dexter's our dog for those who don't know.

But um anyway, you know, it's just a great season of life that you get to enjoy.

And and I I hope I'm a better G daddy than I was a dad.

Sure.

You know, because obviously you're you're uh you you've learned a lot, as you said, and and you're older and wiser and and a little more calm than probably uh I was at 20 when I got married, and 21 or 22, you know, when we started having kids.

So yeah, it's good.

I love that.

Um the nature of grandkids, the nature of kids, uh this is a question I I want to talk about marriage right after this, uh, but I want to ask this question first.

You have so many parents that are trying to figure out how much is too much in the schedule, and the schedule is kind of hijacking our lives.

How did you as a dad, uh all four years were in extracurriculars of some nature, how did you find the balance with uh their week in, week out schedules and not letting the week in, week out schedules, and extracurriculars hijack y'all's lives and become idols?

Yeah.

Yeah, and that that's a that's always gonna be a challenge, all right.

Um you know, all of them played sports or band, um, you know, musicals, plays, uh Lindsay Beth cheerleading.

I mean, it was something all the time.

And literally with Taylor and Lindsay, they would cheerlead and play football, and at halftime, Taylor would take off his pads and and grab the trumball and then go play in the band.

And Lindsay Beth, you know, you know, they they they would do it all.

Um I I think the uh important thing about that was uh twofold.

One, Tammy and I were always there.

It was a family affair.

We were all in.

The younger kids were there with the older ones, and and and so we just we whatever we were doing, we were doing as a family.

Okay.

And uh so it wasn't like one was going off by themselves, okay, doing one thing.

Um, and then the second thing is this, they knew the priority was was the Lord.

Um, so uh they didn't miss Sunday, they never got up one Sunday morning and asked, what are we gonna do today?

Yeah, never happened.

Yeah.

Um the other thing I would say is this um, that if we were in revival uh or if something majors significant was going on, you could go to practice.

You know, but um when it was time to be there, I mean I I've seen Taylor come in and with his football, you know, uniform on and sit on the back row of revival meeting.

Um and and then, you know, when it wasn't um extracurricular activities, um, like I said, we just did ministry together.

So I was making a hospital visit, they were usually going with me.

That's cool.

You know, if if we were going out on visitation to go talk to somebody, they may be going with me.

Um we went to camp.

We, you know, we would go on mission trips.

We just did everything together.

And um and and I I think it's good that they uh are involved and that they, you know, are participating.

And there's no two alike.

Right.

You know, so don't try to make them be somebody that they're not.

Don't try to make them uh do exactly what you did or chase your dream.

But um, but I think it's good that they were busy and involved, but they always knew God comes first.

It's good.

Yeah, you have four, all four of them love Jesus, and uh, I don't think that's just because you're uh a pastor, because I see plenty of pastors that have kids that don't love Jesus.

So uh my last question, maybe in the parenting world, would be what were things that you and Miss Tammy did to establish a rhythm uh in their lives so that their faith kind of became their own?

Because there's a lot of parents wondering, how do I help my kid?

That you we say all the time to our parents in Kidville, uh, you are your kid's primary spiritual influence.

And so I think sometimes it's intimidating, and parents are like they're hearing that.

It's like, oh, what do I how do I do that?

I don't know how to be my kid's primary spiritual influence.

What are some ways you guys did that?

Yeah, um you know, the world well the word is just authentic.

Just be real.

That's good.

You know, um we're not perfect, they can see it.

You're gonna mess up when you do, you have to apologize, you gotta make it right, you gotta acknowledge it.

Um you know, I I think that they saw us live out our faith.

It was real to us.

You know, we you you're not one person at church as somebody else at home.

Right.

I mean the the the pastor grant, Miss Tammy, you see at church as so you're gonna get at home, and and neither one's perfect.

Sure.

You know?

Um and and so they saw that.

And then, like I said, um it wasn't that hey, you can go to camp if you want to, or you can go to uh children's ministry if you want to, or no.

I exposed them to the things of God constantly.

They were there every time the door was open.

And uh it doesn't mean they always wanted to be there, you know, but there was a time that they had the exposure and every opportunity that it became real to them.

And um I I think that you know ultimately uh th they've got to just see parents who are like the men and women of the Bible, the men and women of faith.

They weren't perfect, they had weaknesses, um, you know, but it it it wasn't a facade or show.

You know, it was real, they had real faith.

And it was real life.

And and so we just we constantly exposed them to all of that and uh and prayed for God's grace that ultimately it would become real to them.

I love that.

That's incredible.

Um so much of what you shared uh throughout this entire time has been me and Miss Tammy, me and Miss Tammy.

So marriage uh is a huge part of parenting in many people's lives.

Uh 41 years in August, right?

You guys will have been married, incredible.

What is one piece of marriage advice you would give to the dad at home?

Uh hey, this is foundational in your marriage, and as you start to raise kids, what's one thing you would tell them?

Uh I I think the number one gift that you can give to your children as a dad is love their mom.

That's good.

You know, my kids all knew I loved them, but you're not number one.

Yeah.

You know, Jesus is number one, and next to him is your mother.

That's good.

Um, so I think the number one thing you can give your kids is to love your spouse, honor her, treasure her.

And I could also tell you that um they knew there was one button you did not want to push.

And uh they knew there was one thing that would just set dad off.

If they sassed their mother, disrespectful to their mother, um, they knew you know that I would come unglued.

Uh in fact, I've said to them many times, that woman brought you in this world, and I can take you out.

And, you know, and it I'm not sure that's uh politically correct today, but a little bit of fear you were talking about earlier.

I think some of that fear.

They need the fear of God, yeah.

So really, I think loving and respecting your wife and teaching them to do that is so important.

Yeah.

That's so good.

My dad used to say that to me all the time, too.

I don't know if that's like a southern thing, but it it would whip me up right quick and in a hurry.

And uh I just remember like, hey, that's my friend.

He's my dad.

Uh I respect him.

I will listen to him because the hand don't feel good on my backside.

And there was as much as he was my friend, there was one thing that was always off limits, and that was disrespect toward my mom.

For me or my sister.

It was like, that's do you want to see him red line real quick?

That's they could say what they I mean, really.

I would tolerate it.

They you know, they may say something to me smart or whatever.

Wouldn't set me off.

Right.

You you say it to your mom.

I mean, I would come unglued on them.

I love that.

That's good, man.

That there's I feel like there's been so much good here.

Um as a parent.

Yeah, and that's that's what I would just encourage.

I I would encourage you to do things as a as a family.

I would encourage you um not to grow apart as a husband and wife.

You know, too many couples, they are pouring their lives into their kids, and kids are number one, and and the dad's taking this one here, and the mom's taking this one here.

And then, you know, when those kids graduate and leave home and you have an empty nest, uh, you know, the husband and wife looks at one another and says, Who are you?

I know, man.

Um, and that that's where we see so many uh split up and divorce.

And so, but for the grace of God, all of us would.

I mean, marriage is not easy.

You got two sinners living together, you know, under one roof and and sleeping in the same bed, and and and so it's only by God's grace that any of us, you know, can can make a marriage last 41 years and and stay with it.

But you know, bottom line is it as a dad, what will you tell your kids, you don't quit.

Man, you signed up for this, you're gonna finish it.

Keep going.

You know, they never signed up for anything.

They might at the end of the year, you know, I might let you reconsider, but if you ever signed up and made a commitment, you're staying with it.

Well, that's that way in marriage.

Yeah.

You know, um you you made a commitment, we're not quitting, we're gonna keep working on this, and and and we're going to stay in love with each other.

Because God gave you each other before He gave you those kids.

And and and that's you know, this is the permanent relationship, husband and wife.

Um parenting somewhat is temporary.

Sure, you're you're their parent, but uh not in the sense that they obey you forever.

No.

They they obey your parents when you're young, you honor them.

Right.

You honor your parents e even as an adult.

Yeah, that's so good.

I I And care for them.

And care for them.

And I'm speaking to all four of my kids right now.

You know, I'm gonna be old and and somebody's gotta care for me.

So uh, you know, make sure uh you take good care of dad.

Yeah, that's good.

That's good.

Get that shameless plug in there.

Um I think that's huge.

Man, I see it all the time.

Um the priorities are out of whack, right?

And and it's like it's it's not even it's a noble thing at first.

You love this kid.

Uh you you watch them grow up and you have deep affection for them, and somewhere along the ways, along the line, the priority gets a little lopsided, and now the kids start to become more important than the marriage, and uh it's just not how God designed it.

And you gotta pursue your spouse first, you gotta go run after your wife men first, and uh the rest of that stuff starts to fall into the state.

Yeah, and uh you know, I was with Joby Martin at a conference uh recently, and and he made the statement, I've heard him say it before, you know, um there's no pain like kid pain because there's no love like kid love.

That's good.

And um it is true.

I mean, you love your kids, and and you think, wow, could you know, can I love a another child like I love this first one?

And the answer is yes.

Yes, yep you know, you know what that's like.

And and um but but uh in all of that, you know, Jesus has got to be number one.

He's gotta be first.

And and then you you gotta continue to um fan the flame uh with you and your wife.

You know, don't ever stop flirting with your wife and don't ever flirt with anyone else.

Amen.

Come on.

That's good.

David Nasser, uh, was the campus pastor when I was at Liberty University and he used to say, uh, my wife makes an awesome wife, but she makes a terrible god.

And I think it's true of kids too.

Like they're awesome kids.

But the priorities have to be in line or else we're gonna get it wrong.

So that's really good.

Yeah, and uh you you last thing I'd say about marriage uh is is this.

You know, I I've told men this over the years.

The Bible says that the wife's the weaker vessel.

And and uh what that means is this, and I wanna put it in terms everybody can understand.

It means that she's fine China.

That's good.

And guys, you're a paper plate, you know.

That's it.

That's good.

I like it, I love it.

That's good.

Okay, I want uh one more answer out of you.

Rapid fire question.

So we've had a lot of conversation, so much good in there.

I would just say this is not exhaustive, but it has been really good and really insightful.

So uh there's still a ton to learn about uh fatherhood and marriage, and uh that's why we want you guys to keep going on the journey with the podcast because we're gonna keep exploring these conversations.

But uh, we've covered a lot.

I got one more rapid fire question for you, and it is this you have a Saturday off.

There are no kids, there is no wife, there are no distractions.

What is Pastor Grant doing?

Work.

More work.

All the things I couldn't do because I was with her and because I was with them and grandchildren and uh everything else, you know, there's always so much to be done.

Right.

And and unfortunately, I don't Sabbath well.

I love working, I love what I do, and I've always got on my to-do list things that need to be done.

But if you're asking the question, what do I enjoy doing for a hobby?

Yeah, um, you know, I love boating.

I love water sports.

So if I had a Saturday off, I would want to spend it out there, you know, on the water.

Um uh I had maybe an hour or two the other day that uh I uh I could just, you know, go do something.

And so I went over at Taylor's and uh, you know, we were doing uh we were shooting some guns and doing some target uh practice and you know it's a good way to spend an hour and so yeah, I that's probably how I'd spend it.

I love it.

Just some good man.

You are the friend that you were talking about earlier.

Hey, it's better if a friend has a boat than if you have a boat in the middle of the state.

That's right.

Come on.

That's great.

I love it, that's good.

Hey, I I just want to say to all the fathers out there, you know, don't beat yourself up.

I'm just telling you, we all mess up.

And and God was a perfect father to Israel, and yet they still chose to rebel.

That's good.

So ultimately you're gonna make mistakes, and that's where God's grace is greater than our sin.

And then number two, you know, you're not responsible for what your children do, you're responsible for what you do.

That's good.

And so I I I just think a lot of Father's Day, you know, the message is everybody man up and and you be a man of God, and you know, there's a lot of pressure there, and and and I think those things are true.

You ought to man up and you ought to be a man of God.

But um just realize, hey, you're a sinner, you're gonna mess up, and God is the only one who's the perfect heavenly father, and when you mess up, you run to him, and um and he continues that work he started in us.

Yeah.

And and and so don't give up, don't grow weary and well-doing.

Uh, you just stay close to Jesus.

That's good.

And it reminds me, uh, we have a prayer promise, right?

And what I love about this prayer promise, I'm gonna ask you uh to read it, but you probably don't need to read it at this point.

Um what I love about it is it it is coming to you with the presupposition that you have already established and ask.

You're already asking something.

And so for a lot of these dads, this conversation is hey, ask something, go to God with something, let him lead you in grace uh with something.

And so I think it's a great segue to the prayer promise if you would read that.

Well, uh the the most powerful prayers are when we pray the promises of God's word.

And this is the one I've claimed now for 41 years.

Um now unto him, who is able to do exceedingly abundantly more than we could ask or think, according to the power that works in us.

Unto him be glory in the church by Christ Jesus throughout all ages, world without end.

And everybody said, Amen.

Amen.

Amen.

That's good.

So good.

More.

He wants to do more in your parenting, he wants to do more in your marriage, uh, and he's capable of it.

So start asking, go on the journey with us.

Uh so much good stuff in the conversation today.

And we don't want you to miss it.

We want you to glean as much as you can from uh all these conversations, right?

None of these are exhaustive in nature.

That's not going to be everything you need to know about parenting or marriage, but there's a ton of really good stuff.

We can all get better.

We can all get better.

And so uh, how can you help us with that?

You can like, you can subscribe uh to this channel, and you can go on a regular journey with us, you can watch these, you can share these things, and you can enter giveaways in these things.

So uh we said at the beginning of the episode we have a Bass Pro gift card giveaway.

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Here's how you can do that.

You can go to the comment section right now and just comment it's life and it will plug you into that giveaway.

So uh if this was helpful, like, share, subscribe, go on the journey with us.

There's gonna be more content in the future that we think will be helpful because this is where uh real faith and real life meet, and we want to have those conversations.

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Meet real life.

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