HeavenEarth Conversations with Elli Howard

What would it look like to start a community that was really.

It's for the people like Jesus would be for.

Welcome to Heaven Earth Church.

I'm Ross Stackhouse, the founding pastor of Heaven Earth Church.

From the start, our heart has been to be a church for people who

don't fit neatly into church.

We want to meet people where they are and know their stories.

Because in every story, there is God story.

And this podcast is just about that.

It's about inviting you into the stories of the people of Heaven

Earth Church.

So let's turn to the story.

Hello, good people.

Welcome to the Heaven Earth Church podcast.

This is the podcast where we look to share about a church which

has its mission to make a lasting impact on our community.

We part of the way.

One of the ways we do that, we get to know the people who are part

of the community here at Heaven Earth Church and a little

bit about their stories.

And our guest today is Ellie Howard.

Ellie, welcome to our conversation.

Yeah, thank you for having me.

Ellie, just.

Let's just learn a little bit about you.

I know you've been a part of church for a while, but tell us a

little bit about your background.

Where did you grow up?

For instance, what's hometown for you?

Actually, right here in Whiteland.

Yeah, I live just down the road, so I've been here for 22 years,

so.

And you're.

You're 22 is what you just said.

Yeah, I'll be 22 this Thursday.

Yeah.

Well, happy birthday.

I didn't.

I didn't pick up on that, so.

Well, that is.

That's awesome.

So tell us what you've been doing with your life.

Are you in school or you have a career?

What.

What are you involved with right now?

Currently I'm a senior in college.

I just started my senior year a couple weeks ago, so I'm.

So my degree I have to think about.

This is.

Sorry, Brad.

I don't really.

I don't think well on my feet, but.

So it's a bachelor's degree of.

In English and writing.

English and writing?

Really?

Yes, sir.

Awesome.

So are you looking to like, be.

Be a writer, an author or a publisher of some sort?

I would love to be, but I'm also looking into like journalism.

Cause I do photography on the side.

So I'm looking into like photojournalism or sports photography

and stuff like that as well.

Yeah.

Cool.

Have you been able to.

To engage in that a little bit, doing some photography or sports?

Yeah, yeah.

My younger brother was on the baseball team during his high school

Career and I was able to kind of like, do the photos for just like

during the games and things for the team, so that was really

cool.

And I do like the side projects on.

On the.

For like graduating seniors.

I do grad.

Like grad photos.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Awesome.

Awesome.

Well, that's.

That sounds exciting.

So you.

Could you see yourself having a potential career in journalism

or photography or something along this line?

I'm hoping.

Yeah.

I'm.

I'm.

I'm hoping.

So what would be kind of if you res.

Are for your job for you?

I mean, honestly, like, I love baseball, so I think it'd be really

cool to be a photographer for like the Cincinnati Reds baseball

team or just baseball in general.

But it's kind of more of a wishful thinking, I think, at the

moment.

But I just.

I'm just trying to get through my college education, so.

I have a dream.

That is awesome.

I didn't.

I know that I've seen you at the church softball games.

I don't know, just being a part of that.

Were you yourself in school?

That kind of thing?

I mean, I played soccer when, like when I was a kid, but I know

I've never really picked up on the sports during like my high school

career, unfortunately.

But I've been more into like the creative arts.

Yes.

Well, tell us.

I know that you're a musician.

Tell us a little that.

What kind of things do you do in the area of music?

Oh, well, I mean, primarily I'm a worship leader here at the

church.

I like.

We.

There's a few different people who do that, so I'm just kind of

one of the one person within the cycle.

So that's mostly what I do for music.

I kind of just play.

I. I don't really have any gigs on the side, unfortunately.

I'd like to do something like that eventually, but I just don't

really have a lot of time right now, unfortunately.

But.

Well, I know you play piano and you sing and.

Yes, sir.

And that's.

That's awesome.

And then so.

And then so tell me what's.

As far as being a worship leader at the church here?

Tell.

Share with the folks are listening kind of.

What does that mean?

What does it mean to be a worship leader?

That's actually an extraordinary question.

I don't know because, like, I've.

I've only been doing it for maybe a little over a year now, and

it's still something that I'm.

I. I'm still learning.

So I think just being a worship leader from what I'VE experienced

is kind of just showing up and just not being afraid to hide where

you're at with your relationship with the Lord.

And I find that's been really helpful for me, just being vulnerable

in that aspect.

I mean, also knowing that it's okay not to share everything that's

on my heart.

But I think that sharing some of those things, like kind of opening

the door into my own life when I'm on stage and kind of presenting

the music and being with the other people on the team, it's been

beneficial for me.

Cause I feel like I've grown in my relationship with God.

And I feel like if I'm able to kind of experience, like share that,

that maybe my experience can help draw people closer as well.

Yeah.

It seems like also it's a little bit more than just music only.

Like leading, singing.

It is also helping people draw people into the experience.

Yeah.

And being present.

Yeah.

And kind of helping guide that process and being present, as you

say.

So tell me about a kind of an aha or God moment that maybe you've

experienced either in leading worship or be a part of a worship

experience where you kind of.

Okay, God is really real here.

Yeah.

Honestly, I don't know if I'll be able to pinpoint a specific one

because there's been multiple times where I've kind of felt the

Lord's presence.

And it's been more kind of like an epiphany.

Epiphany moment.

I think it was.

There's one specific moment going back to around the time of

the election of last year where I was leading worship the weekend

leading up to the election.

And it was just.

I felt very tense because I've never been.

Politics aren't really my thing.

And so.

But so I think just being able.

Because that.

That weekend, I think Ross was.

Had talked about politics quite a bit in one of his sermons,

like leading up to that sermon.

And I think just opening up a space that I really felt God's presence

because I felt like everybody.

Like we.

We could sit in the room and be okay with our differences.

And I really felt the Lord in that because I felt like there was

a sense of, like, understanding even when it's difficult.

And I don't know.

I hope that answers the question.

But I would say that that really in that moment, I felt like

God's presence.

So it sounded like you kind of went into that time period with some

anxiousness and discon.

Discomfort and you came out with a little bit of at peace in

some form or another.

Is that.

Am I.

Is this.

Yeah, we're at a law at all.

Yes.

Yes.

And I think that's a lot of what.

What worship is often about.

Help us to find a place.

Help us find God's place of centering 100 place.

And that's when we could do that in worship.

That's a.

That's a cool thing.

I would just say, from my observation, you really.

Your.

Your authenticity in leading worship has been really meaningful

to me.

Oh, thank you.

My wife, as we've seen you do that, and I've seen how people react

to that.

So let me go there for.

I've seen how people react in a very positive way to your leadership.

So let me tell you about.

Let me ask you about that then, Ali, in terms of how do you

think.

How do you think people react to your leadership in music or other

things like that?

Are you finding some affirmation in what you're doing?

I definitely am, yes.

And not, though, necessarily searching for that affirmation.

It's.

It's nice to receive the positive feedback from people just

because, like.

Like, personally, I am.

I'm very, like, insecure.

And so when I'm up on stage, like, I don't necessarily have a

problem being vulnerable, but afterwards, sometimes I go into this

mindset of, like, oh, why did I say that?

Why did I share that?

But then I've had some of the sweetest people come up to me and

give me a hug and just be like.

Like, thank you for sharing and thank you for being you.

That's awesome.

And that just.

It really means a lot to me.

That's awesome.

Well, that's all very cool, and that tells us a little bit about

your engagement in heaven or church right now.

But let's go back a little ways.

How did you get first.

How did you first hear about or get to know or become aware about

Heaven Earth Church?

Yeah, so I think that was.

We've been.

My parents and I have been coming to this church since, I want

to say, like, the fall of 23, I believe.

So roughly two years.

Little about two years now.

I think they first heard it.

My parents first heard about it, I believe.

Like, I'm not sure if it was, like, through Facebook or something

like that, but my dad had found the church.

And so fall of 23, we had visited.

And I think after, like, two weeks, we're like, this is for us.

This is our home.

It was.

I think it was just the atmosphere, just Ross being so late.

Like, kind of how you've expressed is just Very authentic

and genuine.

And he didn't, he wasn't rushed.

It didn't feel like we were being preached at.

We were, we were being talked to.

It was a conversation.

And I felt like that.

And coming from the background that we have, like, that was a really

nice change.

Nice change of pace.

Yeah.

So we've been here.

Yeah.

For about two years now.

Well, there you go.

There you go.

Well, you touched on it coming from the background that you come

from.

Tell a little bit about your.

We're going to come back to your involvement here at heaven or

church in a minute here.

But tell me a little bit of Ellie about your background growing

up.

You know, did you have a faith background growing up?

Tell me a little bit about maybe any connection that you had

to the Christian walk of life before coming to heaven.

Tell us a little bit about that.

Yeah, so I've actually, I mean, I've grown up in a Christian

household.

My dad has been in ministry for over 20, 25 years, just throughout

his life.

And as he's.

As him and my mom have like gotten married and all that, like,

they were always very heavily involved in the church and so they

moved here to Whiteland.

It was in 2002 when they moved here.

2003.

Sorry, no, 2004 is when they moved here.

About year after I was born.

So my dad, over the course of the next few years planted a church.

It's actually just down the road here.

It was called South Point.

South Point Church.

And he was the lead pastor there.

And so that's for the first 10 years of, really my 10, 11, 12 years

of my life is, was at that church.

And so that's kind of what I just, I grew up within like a very,

yeah, very Christ centered household and within the church and

just in the people that I really hung around with.

And the church had closed in 2019, I believe, unfortunately.

And then from 2019 to 2023 we just kind of hopped to churches and

it was just.

It just wasn't the same as what it was like when my dad was

pastoring just because we weren't within the immediate circle

of people.

So it was just really hard to connect and kind of form relationships.

And the churches themselves, they were great.

They didn't necessarily really fit our value system.

And so when we found Heaven Earth Church, we were like, this

is perfect.

So you're a pk, is that right?

I am.

I am a pk, yes sir.

For those of us, those who are not initiated PK as a preacher's

kid, I am A retired pastor myself, but I'm also a preacher's

kid, and so that's kind of shorthand for being a preacher's

kid.

But so.

And that comes with it some great stuff, but also some challenging

stuff.

And I. I'm.

We don't need to go details of it, but I'm sure if you were involved

with your folks, the time with building a church and a closing,

I'm sure that was a painful time and.

And then looking for a church and so on.

That sound like the time of searching.

Yeah, it was definitely a difficult season of life, trying

to figure that out.

Yeah, for sure.

So what kind of challenges did you personally have kind of in that

season of searching and trying to figure out a direction in life,

especially, you know, as a.

You're a teenager at the time, I assume, and a lot of this was going

on.

Were you.

Were you feeling like God far away or you find yourself in a search

mode?

What.

Tell me a little bit about that, how you were dealing with all

that.

I mean, when the church.

When I found out the church was closing and that my dad was kind

of taking a step back from the pastoring role, I was.

I mean, I felt heartbroken and not like I wasn't angry at my dad.

I'm really glad that he was able to kind of navigate where he

was in life and be able to determine the fact that this isn't

necessarily something that I can.

Would that I want to do anymore.

And I admire him for that.

That bravery.

Yeah.

To take a step back and realize that.

But I think for me, like, it was.

It was difficult.

It was difficult season just because I've never been great with

change.

And so it kind of threw me for a loop, for sure.

I was just very anxious.

And there were other things going on at the time that kind of

added to that.

But sticking with the topic of conversation, I would say that I

think I was more in like, a searching mode and just trying to

find community again and like, with.

Because making friends has kind of been something that I've

struggled with and.

But so it did take a while.

So it was kind of.

Kind of a discouraging season of life.

But once we found heaven, Earth Church, like, and there before

heaven or church, there was another church that we were at for

about.

For a handful of.

For a couple years, and I found some community there.

But once we found heaven, Earth Church, yeah, I just, again,

I feel like there's a sense of just strong authenticity here that

really touches my heart and means a lot to me because I feel

like in a lot of, like, Western culture, it's like people

at church, there's, like, an expectation to portray, like, happy,

go lucky all the time.

And it's just.

That's exhausting to me because that's not how.

That's not how I roll.

But the.

You mentioned a couple things here that I think are interesting.

You mentioned searching.

You mentioned.

Mentioned a season of discouragement and a, you know, some

painful moments there.

And I kind of worked on the premise, Ellie, that a lot of people

in our world are kind of discouraged and searching for community.

You also mentioned community as well.

So how do you think heaven or church has helped in kind of responding

to some of those issues that you mentioned there?

Discouragement, searching, community.

How's your experience of Heaven Earth Church responded to

those needs that you had that may be reflective the needs of other

people have as well?

I mean, do you mind repeat the question?

I'm so sorry.

Let's just make sure I'm understanding.

Okay.

You mentioned being discouraged.

Okay.

So let's talk about how Heaven Earth Church may have responded to

that.

Maybe been a rejurer to you and how that might then be helpful

to other people.

Let's go there.

Okay.

Yeah.

So I would say.

I think it's just, again, the atmosphere, it's very welcoming.

Like, you walk in and there's.

There's just a sense of just.

I mean, I know for me, there's almost a sense of comfort.

Of course, I've been here for two years now, so I feel that way.

But even just walking the first time, it was like.

It just felt warm.

And meeting Ross and Ashley Walton Owens, who was here at the

time, like, they were both very.

Well, Ashley just had a smile on her face.

She was just.

It was so.

She was.

She was wonderful.

And Ross, I just think it was just.

He wasn't afraid to be himself.

And he was very relatable in the way that he.

That he.

That he talks about God and his own relationship and where he's

at.

And.

And I think that kind of just.

I mean, that bleeds into the congregation as well.

Like, people just.

I just.

I found that very encouraging.

And it was very different because a lot of the time, again,

you just.

From the.

From my experience and like, you know, kind of church hopping

a little bit during those couple years in between our church

closing and coming here, it just.

People were just.

It just.

It felt cold almost and not as.

Let's go with that for a second.

You've mentioned searching, church hopping, things of that nature.

Just in your observation and your experience, what kind of things

were you searching for that you may have found here at Heaven

or a church that maybe might relate to other people's search as

well?

What were you searching for?

Like, maybe you were searching for certain things in other churches.

It just didn't work out.

It wasn't there.

You found something here.

I mean, I. I know I've repeated myself multiple times now,

but I think, again, it's just community.

And like, I feel like it was just like an instant connection.

And you've mentioned community.

And so how do you think that community then is kind of manifested

itself?

How do you.

How have you experienced community?

Or how have you experienced community where people are showing

just, you know, care and deep concern and it's lived out?

How do you think communities lived out at have.

Or have our church?

How do you think it's lived out?

Yeah.

I mean, I feel like it's different depending on.

Just depending on the person.

But I would just say, like, in their vulnerability.

Okay.

And again, like being present.

So let me.

Let me just go a little.

In their vulnerability.

So you feel like vulnerability is honored or, you know, some cases,

vulnerability is kind of makes people feel so uncomfortable, they

don't really want to deal with it.

Have you felt when you.

I've seen you be vulnerable, and I've seen, you know, how people.

I.

My observation responded to you.

Do you feel like when you've been vulnerable, you've seen the

vulnerability around the heaven or church community that it's

been embraced or has it been.

Or, you know, some places might recoil.

Tell me how you experience vulnerability, People, how people

respond to that.

I definitely.

I definitely, from what I've experienced, I definitely think it's

honored.

It's been honored and.

And not, you know, pushed under the rug.

Yeah.

So to say.

Because, yeah, I mean, most people do respond to vulnerability

and like, just.

It's uncomfortable and it's like, like, like tight and you.

And it's something that you don't necessarily want to address.

But I feel like here it's been embraced and I.

But I feel like that aspect is.

Is.

Is very valuable in your relationship with people such as

the congregation here at the church, but also with the Lord.

Yeah.

And it's.

It's rich in substance and like, that's the type of relationships

that, like, I've.

That I've always, like, been very blessed by and want to experience

more of.

I think that's really a powerful statement that you're making

right there, that it's blessed and it's honored.

I love that.

Now, let me go with you here a little bit, Ellie, in this terms

of your observation of kind of the world that you live in, what

I mean by that is, whoever you connect up with, you're in your school

or your social life or people, you just encounter social media,

anything along that idea.

Do you think there is a need for people to be people, organizations

like a church, to be vulnerable or be a place where vulnerability

can be honored, as you say?

Is there a gap out there, I'm asking you?

I think so.

I think there is, because I.

But I mean, I definitely say that there is something lacking in

the general community.

Yeah.

And I feel like people just find it very difficult to be.

To be authentic and to be themselves.

Yeah.

And when the opportunity presents itself, oftentimes they're

being.

They're met with resistance and.

Or shame and guilt for perhaps.

Or shame for being vulnerable.

Shame.

Guilt.

So powerful.

Yeah.

Charged words, but real, aren't they?

Yeah.

Yeah.

And there's a lot of pressure, I think, on a lot of people, especially

young.

Just my observation, younger people.

My own children are.

Well, they're a little older than you now, but, you know, my own

shut scene of my own children dealing with the pressures of this

world, in this life.

Yeah.

One of the things we say around heaven or church or one of

the phrases or.

That's used around here quite a bit.

If you feel like you don't fit in church, you fit here.

Is that true?

And if so, how so?

I would say it's very true.

I would say it's very true.

Again, there's just.

There's something about the church and that's influenced both

by the leadership and the congregation that just invites.

I don't know.

It just.

I feel like it didn't.

It.

The first thing that kind of came to my mind, that it invites

broken people and not that you have to be broken to be here.

No, I think there's an.

There's aspects of.

I think in.

In the individual, there's an.

There's something missing or broken and hurting.

There's pain.

A lot of pain.

Sure.

And I feel like, again, coming here, that pain is met with comfort.

Whereas again, within the Americanized Western culture and

within the Americanized Western church, there's a sense that

you have to hide that brokenness and you can't take off

your mask to be authentic because it's met with resistance

and, again, shame.

But here I just.

I believe that it's nurtured and you're met with love and Support.

So, yeah.

So when we say if you feel like you don't fit in church, you

fit in here, that works for you.

And because of the brokenness about the things that you've mentioned

here, let's just take it to this.

You feel like you would be.

Let's just say there's a person in your life, Ellie, who's

got some brokenness, some pain point, whatever it is.

They're, you know, having trouble in school, they got any issues

with a professor, or they got to break up with a boyfriend, or

there's, you know, substance abuse, any, you know, home life is

events, any number of things, and they've confided in you.

And because you have been someone that they can approach to,

do you feel like having our church is the kind of place that

you feel comfortable inviting them to come and to experience community

that goes beyond your personal relationship, you know, just to kind

of expand on you.

Is this a place you would feel comfortable inviting such a person?

100%, yeah.

Yes.

So having said that, to kind of bring this conversation around,

what do you think is the kind of thing you say to a person who

might be watching us here today, Ellie, listening to this podcast,

and they've broken this in their life.

You know, whatever it is, you know, it's hurt, his pain, the separation

only from.

Maybe they feel separation from God, maybe feel separation from

some other family life.

So what kind of thing would you want to share with that person?

Maybe kind of checking out of our church.

What would you want to share with them?

Say that there you are under no obligation or no expectation to

share your pain.

But we're here.

I know, like, personally, like, I'm willing to listen.

Not that I'm all that in a bag of chips.

That's not what I'm saying.

I just mean that I think just from how.

From when I've shared my own grief and pain with people here at

the church, I have found that they have been very, again, very

receptive and very loving and supportive, and they oftentimes help

me.

Help me carry that burden a little bit.

Yeah.

And so I would say, again, you're under no obligation to share

any of the things going on in your life, but when you feel comfortable

doing so, I feel like this would be a good place to share and

be open.

Awesome.

Well, what a wonderful message you shared with the folks who may

be checking.

Checking out the church here in Whiteland.

And I think you've just shared several things here, Ellie.

They're just so important about responding to things like shame

to find a place of some comfort in the midst of discomfort

and finding a place of community when a lot of people, you

know, have disconnected us or disunity or non community.

And I, I think you've shared several things here and I thank you

for sharing a little bit of the, you know, some vulnerable parts

of your life here in conversation.

And I know that if somebody check out heaven of church in person

and if they hear whether you are in leadership, leading worship

in music or part of the very small group, that you're the type

of person that people, especially maybe young people, I

want to see what's behind that smile.

Well, thank you for being with us.

Our guest today here on the Heaven Earth Church podcast, Ellie

Howard.

Thank you so much for having me.

We want to thank you for spending time with us today.

My name is Ross Stackhouse, the pastor to Heaven Earth Church.

And you may think out there that your story story is over, but

in fact, your faith story may just be beginning.

If you want more information about our church or you're interested

in the next step, you can go to heavenorthchurch.org Otherwise,

we look forward to being with you next time at the Heaven Earth

Church podcast.