Introducing Lent - Episode 1 with Joseph McAuley

listen wura Welcome to our first limited

edition short season podcast and uh

We've creatively titled this introducing

lent because uh as a church we're

leaning into lent and so we're having

three podcast episodes come out where

we're having different guests uh come in

and maybe just help us on this journey

of understanding what lent is and so

today I'm joined by Joseph mccy uh

Pastor from St Luke's it's awesome to

have you here I feel like the

Pentecostal thing that is usually said

is this is my great friend you know and

uh the other adjective sorry adjective

of course would be phenomenal oh he's a

phenomenal Communicator um so actually

Joseph is my new friend we spent a

couple of hours in a cafe uh late last

year and uh I actually don't know if

he's a phenomenal Communicator or not

but he was pretty engaging in the cafe

and so I thought it'd be amazing to have

him on and just uh unpack some of what

link is with him Joseph do you want to

introduce yourself yeah J thanks Aaron

yeah I I I'm not sure if I'm a

phenomenal Communicator or not but I'll

do our best to answer questions and to

be helpful uh yeah my name is Joseph uh

a pastor a church called St Luke's here

in Tonga as well I've been doing I've

been involved in pastoral ministry here

in Tonga for 25 plus years now youth

pastor associate pastor and then we

planted St Luke's which has been a

wonderful Journey about 15 years ago uh

I do have a sideline interest in

Theology and scripture well it's not

really a sideline industry it is kind of

my main industry but I love that so I've

done a I did a um Ministry internship

diploma did a master's degree did a

doctorate uh largely exploring kind of

Pentecostal Faith uh re-engaging with

some of the wider Church traditions in

the hope of finding uh forms of faith

and spiritual practice and spiritual

disciplines that would be engaging in

the 21st century and help people in the

Journey of following Jesus in the

context we find ourselves so yeah that's

what keeps me busy awesome well I have

brought you here to discuss lint not

from an impartation here group because

um you know I I see those locks

the and I actually had a guy in our

church in Alex 80 years old who always

wanted to lay hands on me and command

follicles to grow and it got a little

bit awkward after a while but anyway

we'll uh we'll leave that to the side um

so Joseph is a doctor it makes me more

comfortable thinking of as Dr J Mack

because you know I'm kind of across from

a doctor but uh it's awesome to have him

here and certainly um I know I've been

journeying with ly for about uh this

will be my fifth year participating

event but I know you've been journeying

a little bit longer than that um Joseph

but if we were to look from a historical

perspective and even just start with the

question what is lint um do you want to

maybe RI off that a little bit yeah for

sure um well essentially as the early

church developed into what we you know

you know the you know started to develop

as uh time goes by into the era of the

church fathers and the apostolic fathers

um one of the things that was really

important for them was to orientate

their their life as Christians as Christ

followers in the Life of Christ uh so

initially that is as simple as gathering

for worship on a Sunday and a Sunday

would be referred to as the Lord's day

and so the early church and early

Christians they'd begin to gather on the

Lord's Day on a Sunday but then they

were what what happened over time was

they developed this thing called the

lurgical calendar or the church calendar

or the Christian calendar it's referred

to in different names but essentially

that a way for them not just to

orientate a Sunday but to orientate time

itself in the Life of Christ uh in the

various um the various kind of chapters

or scenes that we see through the

gospels of the Life of Christ the most

common one that we all we would all know

uh no matter our church background would

be obviously Easter and Christmas so uh

we celebrate we have church on Sundays

we celebrate Easter we celebrate

Christmas well those are all parts of

the lurgical calendar uh but it is a lot

wider it is a lot broader than that and

then hoping to orientate time itself in

the Life of Christ so that we could

learn the lessons from the different the

different seasons of Christ life uh they

came up with uh what they call lint lint

just means um Springtime or or spring

season and lent essentially uh

recognizes the the 40 days that Jesus

Journey Through the Wilderness it's the

40 days of Temptation uh that Jesus face

praying and fasting in the wilderness uh

and they they they aligned that with the

season that that takes us into Easter uh

in the northern hemisphere Easter

happens in spring so lent is those kind

of last 40 days of winter uh so it's

this kind of countdown to New Life New

Beginnings that we celebrate uh in the

resurrection of Christ on Easter Sunday

but in those 40 days beforehand they

recognize the need to uh also the season

of fasting a season of repentance and

acknowledging uh that even as Jesus

walked through the Wilderness even as

Jesus you know went through trials and

tribulations it wasn't always plain sely

uh we as Christ followers go through

those kinds of Seasons as well and those

are not Seasons where God has abandoned

us or where we're alone but those are

seasons when we learn to uh appreciate

that Christ is present with us even in

the wilderness and even in the desert

and even in the trying times so so they

so lenters the 40 days leading into

Easter it's a time of prayer it's a time

of fasting it's a time of repentance

it's a time of giving and recognizing

that um essentially life isn't always um

you know high fives and happy days but

there are other Seasons as well but

Christ is faithful in that with of

course the big countdown being that lent

gives way ultimately to Easter and

Resurrection Life and New Hope and New

Beginnings yeah that's the that's the

heart of it they wanted to the the early

church wants us to live out of every

facet of Christ's life and lent

recognize that the Wilderness experience

is something that Christ navigated and

we will as well awesome so historically

like if we went back to the early church

or um and slightly past that what what

would have there been their practice of

like I've read some of they wouldn't eat

meat or what was kind of their practice

um of commonly in the in those early

days yeah well the early church fasted a

lot they they they fast two days a week

from memory Wednesdays and Fridays were

fast days but lent was a time for

particular fasting it was a particular

season of uh you know repentance it's

not like a somber season it's not like a

Down Season it's not a depressing season

but it's a sober season where we

recognize uh you know some of the trials

and tribulations of life so it would

begin on Ash Wednesday well it begin on

shro Tuesday even so shr Tuesday uh was

the Tuesday before Ash Wednesday sh

Tuesday you uh or no we might you might

commonly know that or or or might be

familiar if use the term pancake Tuesday

so pancake Tuesday was kind of about

eating up the last of the the good food

in one sense we might say uh then you go

to Ash Wednesday where there's a service

where the sign of the cross would be

performed it's a sign of repentance and

a sign of of of trust in Jesus so they

would fast uh for those 40 days

different people would fast different

things some people would fast for from

food for 40 days but that would that's

pretty um not hardcore but it's just

like that wasn't the practice of

everybody it could be giving up meat it

could be giving up um certain meals uh

with the idea being that what you would

put into meals you could set some of

that money aside to give to people time

that you would spend eating you could

set that aside for prayer so yeah um so

fasting prayer uh giving uh repentance

um those would those would be the Fairly

common practices for those 40 days

leading into leading into EAS awesome

and am I right or I might be wrong did

uh did Sunday used be a rest day from it

so they wouldn't actually fast or on the

Sunday is that right yeah correct you

know in church history Sunday is always

the Lord's day or another way of talking

about Sunday is always Easter it's

always Easter Sunday and then the Easter

Sunday that's like the big capital E

Easter Sunday so yeah there is a

tradition that Sunday is always a day of

Celebration rejoicing recognizing that

Christ has risen from the dead with of

course Easter Sunday or Resurrection

Sunday being the big celebration of that

so yeah they would often not fast on uh

on a Sunday uh in modern times uh some

people choose to break their fast on a

Sunday others choose to fast through uh

let's say you're giving up um Netflix

for Lent let's say you you you binge too

much uh television so you've given up

Netflix for length wow for some people

like giving it up for six days and then

binge watching all of the episodes on a

Sunday um I think that maybe you know

you're finding some small print that

gets you out of it uh so some people

would go look I'm going to give up

Netflix for the entirety of Lent others

though who maybe have given up uh coffee

for lint something like that they might

have a coffee on a Sunday and then stra

once it's out of the system flip don't

put it back in on Sunday that's the be

my hot tip if you're doing the caffeine

the first week is the hardest don't go

back in on Sunday or you'll be

withdrawing again on Monday so uh true

story true story but I will say uh I um

I I think uh one time uh part of my link

was uh giving up Coke Zero FY drink and

so but I really enjoyed then Sunday

afternoon getting home from church

having a nice glass of Coke uh and it

was like one cup but that was just kind

of like ah this is uh it was almost

added to the lint experience like the

six days of um that makes me sound like

a real addict but six days of not having

it and then on the seventh day you've

gone to church you've worshiped you come

home you enjoy it and then uh you

continue on with your fast and um so

yeah it's just interesting there's no

hard and fast rules about that I would

say yeah often people do fast right

through but that might give a little bit

of understanding as well where the 40

days comes from because it's slightly

more than 40 days because that allowed

Sundays to be um a break day so to speak

and and you really you highlight a

really good point the the the purpose of

fasting before Easter is that is to walk

walk through and journey through a

Wilderness like experience and know that

God's present and to to pray and to to

give those kind of things but it also

sets up for that transition into

Resurrection Life and celebration so

even in that mini enjoyment of a Coke

Zero after church on a Sunday feeling

like a contrast to what has gone before

the idea of lint is that as we journey

through our 40 days of lint it's

actually preparing us for the

celebration of Resurrection Life that

when Sunday rolls around it's like woo

Easter Sunday he's risen from the dead

and it really is a celebration uh one of

the things I encourage people practicing

link is to think about uh uh the meal

they have on Christmas day so Christmas

is a feast day within the lurgical

calendar as we celebrate uh the birth of

Christ and most families most people go

out of their way to make sure the

Christmas meal is something of a feast

day well the invitation is to do the

same thing on Easter Sunday that our

Sunday lunch or Sunday dinner on Easter

Sunday is a feast day have a celebratory

meal that celebrates that Christ has

risen from the dead and so if you've

been fasting for 40 days but you're

counting down to Resurrection Sunday New

Life new beginnings and this kind of

feast that you're going to share with

friends or family or whatever well man

it really helps to it really helps to

kind of well engage in the season and be

present to The Wonder of Christ's

resurrection and the resurrection work

of Christ in our lives and the he and

them that's awesome so obviously lint

has that historical perspective you know

we're walking in the tradition of the

faith um and a good sense I think what

about what do you think particularly for

21st century um and Us in this Western

context uh why is link powerful for us

here today in this cultural context yeah

great question I look in our in our 21st

Western continent in living in to what

do we live for or what or what do we

orientate our lives or what are our

goals well we live in a world of instant

uh straightway uh no delay gratification

excess abundance fruitfulness like we

want it all and we want it now we very

much live in a in a cultural context

that is trying to accumulate more hold

on to more collect more uh and you know

as quickly as possible well lent

interrupts that and reminds us in the

words of Christ in the the Wilderness

when he's tempted to to turn the stone

into bread it it interrupts that and

reminds us that uh we don't live by

bread alone but by every word that

proceeds from the mouth of God so lent

is this 40-day uh

Interruption essentially to you know our

Western kind of Lifestyles tend to be

ones of instant gratification and O

overindulgence generally so lent

interrupts that and says hey hey hey no

no we man doesn't live by bread alone

but every word that proceeds from the

mouth of God you've got to you there's

there's there's an invitation to slow

down there's an invitation to be still

there's an invitation to fast and to

reorientate The rhythms of those 40 days

in the Life of Christ it's very common

for people to use a lent and devotional

so the journey through the those 40 days

of lent with a with a a basic devotional

that might have some scripture reading

and whoever put it together might have

you know offer some thoughtful uh some

thoughtful um or the invitation to some

engagement regarding some thoughts of of

prayer and repentance and fasting so

it's this it's this real invitation to

interrupt 21st century excess abundance

you know we want it all we want it now

say hey hey whoa whoa slow down true

life is found in the words of Christ

true life is found in the Life of Christ

it's not found in taking off the nexts

goal the next achievement the next

purchase but rather in the the person of

Jesus who gave his life for us so I

think lint is very timely in

interrupting those kinds of rhythms and

inviting deeper Reflections I've been

practicing lint for a long time now 15

16 17 years I I find that as we get

closer to lent if I'm just if I just sit

and be still for a moment my body is

kind of telling me hey hey too much you

know not enough sleep or too much

scrolling on news apps or too much sugar

or too much caffeine or too much you

know this that or the other thing hey

why don't you take a season out why

don't you lay that down and just and

make sure that in this next 40 days you

you're listening to The Whisper Of

Heaven and I think that's a fantastic

Interruption to 21st century culture

that is fast in instant and go go go

very over stimulated uh you know our

phones are these you know Weapons of

Mass distraction and uh you know so

we're constantly scrolling or binging or

watching well lent interrupts that and

puts that aside and says hey be still

and know that God's God and and remember

that we live not by bre alone but every

word that proceeds from the mouth of God

so I think it's a it's a healthy

counterintuitive Interruption to what we

think of as normal life but normal is

whatever we actually design H wow I

think of Paul's words you know where he

said um everything is permissible for me

but I don't want to be Mastered by

anything and I think you know often we

actually pause and go wow I actually

have some acceptable cultural things

that are actually mastering me and

they're actually permissible they're

enjoyable they're not bad but if I don't

have some way of actually um not

allowing them to master me then and so I

think Link's a really good init to that

it's like man there's this thing that's

permissible we're not saying it's wrong

but it's actually like link gives me an

opportunity that maybe it just comes

back into Its Right Place totally 100% I

I think I think that's absolutely spot

on that's how that's one of the major uh

invitations of Lent that I would say we

just like I said it's not bad but we are

addicted to scrolling we're over

caffinated we're overstimulated we're

not sleeping enough or whatever it might

be it's just life it's not bad or it's

or it's not wrong but if you just sit

and be still you realize oh there might

be new life to be found if I could find

some different different rhythms I know

for one year I gave up news apps and

scrolling for all of length um I didn't

pick it back up afterwards and I'm

better for it and yeah I think it's a

healthy invitation yeah I think uh

YouTube uh is on my list this year and

uh I'm a little bit ashamed to admit

what a struggle that's going to be you

know just uh but to actually just uh and

so I kind of have this Jewel thing where

I'm really looking forward to it and

also kind of going man I'm going to

realize actually how much addiction is

there and so um people ask what should I

fast for lint and I often say oh you

know if you if you if you have finish

this question I could never live without

like that's the whatever the answer to

that question is like I could never live

without my morning coffee it's like oh

could you

why don't she give up your morning

coffee for you know I can never live

without my Netflix programs I could

never live without um you know I always

have to a sweet treat and dessert it's

like well instead of we're acknowledging

there's these things I and we don't

literally mean it yes but there is a

sense of Truth to the fact that oh no

that's I wouldn't want to that's I'm

kind of dependent on that that that

frames up it's like oh why don't you

undo that for 40 days and discover that

he can live without it and yeah it's a

healthy challenge I think you've just

triggered uh uh the dozens of people

watching this with the mention of not

having their caffeine but one of the

things that was interesting in my

journey in not doing caffeine is I I

felt like um I came back with a far

healthier relationship to it what I

realized was there were times where I

was having coffees without even enjoying

it thinking about it it was just being

dropped down the hatch um and and moving

on to the next thing and so lent

actually meant hey when I came out of

lint went back to coffee but it had a

far I actually enjoyed it more it was

actually uh a pleasure rather than this

thing that was just being consumed

without being thought of so what's

interesting is sometimes I think you

actually find from the journey on the

other side you actually enjoy the thing

more and not because it means you go

back to binging but it actually holds a

healthy place that uh you actually taste

the coffee rather than let it just drop

down your throat without thinking about

it absolutely absolutely I where our

21st century culture is such a consumer

oriented culture but if we can break

that cycle there is an invitation to be

more of a connoisseur rather than a

consumer and a connoisseur is somebody

that appreciates the Wonder and the

beauty and the

intentionality uh that went into

whatever it might be the meal or the

painting or the you know so there's a

greater sense of this life is a gift

this coffee is a gift somebody you know

there's a greater sense of of

appreciation and when we appreciate

something we don't take it for granted

we don't just you know Down the Hatch

and forget but we are more present to

the moment and you're right it

reorientates our relationship and I

think that's really helping that's so

good so for a lot of Pentecostals we

would be more familiar with like 40 days

of prayer and fasting like that's often

something that we've done as a church or

or within Church culture and it's

obviously a great thing to do um how

would you describe maybe the different

and emphasis of Lent versus your

traditional uh Pentecostal Church 40

days of prayer and fasting and that's

not say that the 40 days of prayer and

fasting is wrong I think we both agree

that's a great thing to do but it's not

identical to lent there is a slight

slight difference perhaps in the way

that as Pentecostals we do it could be

identical Le but it often didn't feel

the same I've not asked you that

question in advance but I wonder a good

um something you you had some thoughts

on yeah I I I think there's way more

overlap than what there is lack of

overlap so I think they're very similar

maybe the maybe the one well maybe the

slight Nuance that I'd put on it would

be that traditional kind of Pentecostal

40 days of prayer and fasting it's often

done with the hope of achieving or

attaining or getting so it's the sense

of um I would like this one of of the

ways that maybe I can get this is that

if I pray and fast and really strive for

40 days and God will see how serious I

am and and we'll get there and there's

we need some deeper thinking about

there's some subtlety and some Nuance

around a measure of Truth in that

there's a measure of Truth to that but

we also have to be careful with how how

we Steward that abolutely so whereas I

think the invitation of Lent is is it's

not something that we're doing to attain

it's something that we're doing in resp

response of so it's it's in recognition

of it's in recognition so I see lent is

kind of a training ground for trials and

tribulations in life it doesn't matter

what we do trials and tribulations in

life are going to come at some stage or

another Well lent is just 40 days each

year where we get to um voluntarily sign

up for some sort of trial and

tribulation now I I you know that's a

very subjective way of describing

somebody you're going without coffee for

40 days and you call that a trial andul

no nevertheless though it is a season

where we're choosing to lay down our

lives in some way shape or form knowing

that God meets Us in that places and is

present to us in the in those places

then what happens is a long life's

journey something does go wrong that is

you know there's grief there's loss

there's heartache there's pain uh you

know there's these realities that we

navigate but suddenly the feeling is

like ah I know how to do this I've done

L for the last 12 years I know what it

is to is I know what it is to be in a

season of prayer a season of fasting a

season of um of laying down my life in

that moment I chose to do it in this

moment circumstances have laid it upon

me but it's an invitation to practice

The rhythms that we would be hoping

would bubble to the surface in the mid

in the what do you want to Bubble to the

surface in the midst of heartache and

pain and tri and grief well you hope

disciplines of prayer disciplines of

attentiveness you're not going to be

feasting and celebrating and heartache

and loss but you're going to be learning

that God's present to us in this season

God walks alongside Us in this season

well we get to practice that in Lent by

choice for those other moments of Our

Lives where we find ourselves in a

Wilderness but maybe it's not one that

we signed up for uh and I so I think

there's there's a sense in which 40 days

in prayer and fasting in the Pentecostal

sense is often a a signing up to go

somewhere get something do something

whereas ly is more of a signing up to

lay down my life and to and to be still

and it's a Letting Go rather than a

striving for and that would be it's so

they're similar but that would be my

subtle probably difference then yeah I

like that and I like the thought you

know uh rather than obtaining it's maybe

becoming like so it's actually you know

rather than something external I'm

hoping for God to do for me I'm actually

becoming and I love the idea that you

had there about link sitting up for

other seasons and one of the other ways

I think that happens is uh sometimes you

can then face a trial and you can

actually be aware oh I know this

particular Vice isn't going to be

helpful for me in this season very good

and so you're actually able to you've

got this history where you go man when I

strip that out of my life I just heard

God that little bit clearer and again

that's uh total optional you know that's

just something that you self diagnose

and go hey maybe in this season of trial

actually watching Netflix isn't going to

help me as I'm processing these emotions

so I've got that history of length that

I can lean into something and say man

maybe for these three weeks while I'm

processing this uh difficult season I

can actually uh remove something that I

know is just going to make me that

little bit more attentive to God so it's

actually it is training us for those

Seasons I I think that's absolutely

brilliant we do humans do have a

tendency to exacerbate or or make the

hard that much worse by responding to it

in bad way I mean a classic example

would be alcohol would be very that's

just a common example often in trials

and tribulations and hard times people

respond um inappropriately and dip into

the bottle in a way that it's probably

not going to help in that situation lent

you choose to fast give up alcohol those

kinds of things hey it sets up healthier

boundaries uh sugar oh it's a tough day

I'm going to binge the cakes it's like L

yeah I think you're spot on I think it

is it's really true again it's the

permissible things that can you know if

they're not managed in a healthy way

actually become vicces rather than

rather yeah and so uh as a church you

guys have done this for how many years

oh at St luks we've done it since day

one which is about 15 15 years 15 years

wow and so how's that been for you as a

church Community um just having that

Rhythm that that time of year how would

you feel it's it's formed you guys as a

church

sure I I think I think when it comes to

the life of the church particularly

coming from Pentecostal background and a

Pentecostal church we do tend to string

together in our calendar uh High Point

to High Point to High Point so the the

conference will lead to the camp will

lead to the guest speaker will lead to

you know whatever it might be we do like

to string together the next thing to

look forward to which is fantastic and I

I think we should all have something on

our calendar that we're looking forward

to that's a really healthy thing to do

but the way life works is that there are

mountain Toops but there's also valleys

uh so by celebrating lent or or

participating in the season of Lent

every year it invites us as a church to

not only orientate around High Point to

High Point to High Point but also to

recognize that at times there's some

Valley experiences which then becomes an

invitation within the context of our

Sunday services to address some topics

that are really important to address but

maybe not everybody wants to tackle or

it's not as exciting uh you know people

will be more excited about a SE a series

on how to be an overcomer than a series

on the nature of sin in our lives and

how we deal with it like to do that that

sounds depressing so you know as a

church Community we've been able to over

15 years explore variety of different

topics that are appropriate to the

season of lint we've done series on

prayer fasting giving um obviously ties

into live that's our series uh oh there

go the secret life there you go plug for

that great series don't miss it uh we've

done other series uh we did a series

called waiting through MTH and we

interviewed people each of the Sundays

of Lent who had navigated trials and

tribulations uh somebody that had

navigated separation somebody that had

lost a loved one to cancer somebody that

uh had you know just different you know

the real realities of what we face and

we've been able to interview them where

was Christ in that moment what did you

learn in that season so that was just a

chance to kind of dip into you know this

where do you where do you put your six

we series on the reality of heartache

and pain well lent's an invitation to

acknowledge that and again not because

they're not they're topics that we

should be confident to tackle knowing

that Christ is present in all of those

Seasons but sometimes where there's

sometimes we're a little bit more

uncomfortable to do that and so yeah

it's certainly been a chance to uh you

know navigate those kinds of topics

we've looked at depression anxiety you

know other other realities of mental

health during the season of Lent and I

found that that's opened up

conversations afterwards for people to

go oh I've kind of tucked that away in

the background for a long time but by

bringing it into the open it gives us a

chance to talk about it to seek God's

wisdom in relation to how to Journey

with anxiety uh where might Christ be in

this and so yeah it's certainly it's an

invitation to a far rounder or far a

more

formed uh idea of discipleship than just

maybe our favorite topics that we like

to hit again and again yeah awesome so

what would be your encouragement um

obviously there'll be people watching

this that have heard of length a little

bit y kind of know it as a bit of a

topic they've got a we bit more

understanding now what would be your

encouragement to them it's their first

year of Lent they're thinking look do I

want to do this what would be U your

encouragement I mean I'm assuming you're

going to encourage want to do it be

Conor how would you frame up for them to

approach this Lent season a few things

we we already mentioned a couple of them

but we will all go through lent and

Seasons whether we want to or not

seasons of being in the wilderness so in

light of that we may as well practice

that in some way shapeable form and the

invitation of uh the spiritual

discipline of fasting and aligning that

with L is to is to practice that so I'd

encourage people like you're going to go

through a Wilderness why not practice

going through a Wilderness how do we

practice going through it well it's 40

days it's a countdown to Resurrection

Life the great hope that we have in

Christ so you know it's a it's a it's a

framed up beginning and end so it's not

you know it's not going to go I have to

give up sugar forever it's like no no

this a 40-day I I encourage people to

think about well what just sit and be

still and where might you be over

stimulated or overindulging or over

caffeinated or and and what could you

maybe lay down i' encourage people to

think about what they could give up for

Lent uh and then I encourage people to

think about what they could take up for

Lent and so uh often for me the taking

of something up for Lent is is in the

form of a devotional and some prayer so

for Lent I'm going to be in this

devotional there's a a reading every day

for 40 days I'm going to read and then

I'm going to spend some time in prayer

and so there's the letting go of

something and the taking up of something

I'd encourage people to think about

where can they get a lent in devotional

you can get them on Amazon you can

download the Kindles you might be

providing them as a church I'm not sure

but there's lots of lots of resources

there so what can I lay down what can I

take up I'm going to journey through the

Wilderness but but Christ Journey

Through the Wilderness and modeled to us

what it is to keep our faith in God and

to be conscious that God's present to us

in all of those Seasons so I'd encourage

that I'd also encourage it's not a

depressing season it's not it's not

intended to be um well that was

depressing it's like no it's the

contrast between Resurrection Life and

the realities of life when it doesn't

feel like a resurrection moment uh as I

as I said before when we string High

Point to High Point together it can feel

like like Well church is always amazing

because we go from one great thing to

another great thing but my life actually

doesn't feel like that my life doesn't

always go from one amazing thing to

another amazing like nobody's life goes

from one amazing thing to another

amazing thing so link gives you a chance

to acknowledge that but it's not

depressing it's it's the it's it's the

wonder that God's present to us and the

Delight that God's present to us in all

season so it's not something to um to

see as being heavy

or um or strict or like punishing for 40

days no it's an invitation to certainly

some disciplines but disciplines are

disciplines are healthy they they

they're good for us so you in your mind

frame it as an invitation to Journey

with Christ Into the Wilderness spaces

knowing that Christ is present take lay

something down and take something and I

think it it's also helpful to remember

particularly in the initial stages it

can actually be really hard and that's

okay like because sometimes we have this

picture like yes I'll lay it down but

straight away there's going to be this

peace and this and uh I've found some

seasons of Lent I seem to have a real

deep connection with God in a way that

seems unique to that lent season I find

others feel far more like disciplined

get to the end of it and go I I survived

it I enjoyed it uh I don't have that

mindset that that's how it has to be but

I also think it's good for people to be

aware hey if it's a tough length Season

for you laying something down that's

still of great value for you and that's

um you know it doesn't have to be

depressive but also if it's not Mountain

Top to Mountain Top that's okay it's

okay for it to be a struggle because I

think some people can go into the season

thinking oh this will be um you know yes

I'm laying something down but oh what

Fellowship I'm going to have and I think

that does happen but it can also um you

know the desert was a desert as well

absolutely absolutely it can be and both

in everything I think that's really

that's really wise advice I mean you

think about running as a as a discipline

some runs you go on you get home and

you're exhausted but it was a joy and a

delight and you ran around the mountain

and the Sun was shining you feel good

kind I runs are a chore and hard work

and um you get home exhausted and it's

like I don't even want to run again yet

it it it's good for you irrespective of

the emotional or the the feelings that

went with it lent is healthy and good

for us irrespective of whether it feels

wonderful or difficult if we are if

you're fasting if you're laying

something down like that doesn't feel

great uh the whole time and especially

like you said in those if you're giving

up coffee those first five six days can

be tough and you have headaches and you

think this is just making my life worse

not better but it's that sense in that

lent is not it's not

about pragmatics it's not about it's not

a tool in our tool belt that we pull out

to achieve like you before attaining

it's it's it's a discipline that helps

us to become and the becoming of want to

run a marathon so you want to become a

marathon runner well the discipline of

training to become a marathon runner is

not always fun and easy but really

worthwhile and really like lifegiving

yeah uh the discipline of becoming like

Christ is to take up our cross and to

lay down our lives and we get to

practice that in length not always

exciting not always easy but very good

for us and healthy for us so yeah you

you that's wise words it will feel at

times like a struggle and challenging

and difficult and you get to day 27 and

you're like how many more days of not

having a Cofe are there it's like it

feels like it's never ending absolutely

that that's what fasting feels like and

yet it is healthy for us in that kind of

counterintuitive way to our 21st century

conscious that always wants things to be

easy and quick and fast yeah you bring

up running but you know scripture does

say you know is it a fool runs when no

one chases him so you know I'm not I'm

not necessarily on the running uh hey

but an analogy but uh I think it's uh

the other thing is to have those those

can be moments of worship for us right

Lord I'm really struggling in this

moment y um you know this is I want to

be closer to you and uh it's not a

transaction but it's just a hard thing

that we can say in that moment hey you

know this is an offering to you and it's

actually remembering that wow that can

be an offering to Jesus and that's

something beautiful that we can give him

I'm wondering if you just want to pray

for us church for those who are going to

be going through length for the first

time for grace and you know that there

would be that sense of of him with us

absolutely it's a delight thanks for

your

time lord we

uh we're mindful that you walked through

the

wildness you you you navigated the

desert for 40 days and it was not easy

for you and yet that was a part of your

formation it was a part of your journey

and being and becoming and doing that

which has ultimately brought us

salvation and life and fullness of love

and we remember your words that man

doesn't live by bread alone but every

word that proceeds from the mouth of God

so as uh El T engages in Lent engages in

that walk through the Wilderness and in

in a season of prayer and a season of

fasting and a season of giving I just

pray that they would know that comfort

of the Holy Spirit they know the guiding

of the Holy Spirit they know the

presence of the holy spirit in the

delightful moments but also in the

difficult and trying moments and that

ultimately it would be an invitation to

a season of growth and a season of

development and a season of refinement

uh a season of being and becoming the

holy whole and wholesome people that

we're called to be in Christ and we

acknowledge that that doesn't always

come about via that which is easy and

fun and exciting sometimes it comes

about by that which is a discipline and

a commitment and a laying down of our

lives and we acknowledge that and we

look to your example in laying your life

down for us and in Lent we practice that

and in doing so we count down to the

fullness of life that comes on Easter

Sunday on Resurrection Sunday and so we

may we be mindful of that as we journey

through length that we are counting down

to Resurrection Life but the only way to

find that Resurrection life is to go

through the valley of the shadow of

death and Lan to an invitation to that

unless the seed falls to the ground and

dies it doesn't spring up and so lent is

about laying down that ultimately we

might find fullness of life in you so

Lord for T may you bless them watch over

them and keep them in all things be

gracious to them and may lent be an

exciting journey of Discovery formation

and exploration in your name amen amen

thanks so much for being with us my

delight loved it thank you so much Aron

awesome

cheers

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