Book of Revelation EPS 2

Chase: Mm-hmm. Cool. Check one, two. Here we go. It's on. We're fade out. Hello everyone and welcome back to the Point Church Podcast. I'm here with Pastor Sam as we are in season two ⁓ of our podcast where we are diving into the book of Revelation. Mm-hmm. ⁓ we did the first week last week, and again, ⁓ our apologies as ⁓ we announced on Sunday, Pastor Sam and I are not technically advanced all that much, so when we decide to upgrade some stuff, we accidentally deleted the entire podcast off. all platforms besides YouTube. So ⁓ if you have found us, and I hope you have, ⁓ this is the new one and we are going to be for sure to not delete this one. Yes, we are locked in here and we've got like holy water out and everything and so it should be all taken care of. It should be. So ⁓ again we occur encourage you to listen to the sermon. ⁓ you know before listening to this specific podcast. Yes. Because it goes hand in hand together. This podcast is going to be a lot of what Pastor Sam couldn't cover in ⁓ the sermon on Sunday. Yeah. ⁓ even with the longer sermon. Yeah, as you can imagine, covering two chapters of the book of Revelation took a little bit of extra time. And so we took our time on Sunday and we 'cause we want to get it right rather than quick. And So yeah, it was a little bit longer and But it was awesome. Yeah, but it was one of those you're like, okay, if we really want to understand I mean, if there's anything to take your time on, it's understanding the end of the world. Yeah. So you know what I mean, a little bit of extra time. Not the worst thing in the world. So definitely. But this is also information that, as we've been saying ⁓ from the pulpit, that Sunday morning is for like, you know, really understanding the broad strokes, the general themes of what's going on in each section of the book, and then this is for Deep dive questions, you know, kind of parsing it out. And we can go longer because again, you can't pause a sermon when it's live, but if you're listening to this podcast, you can pause it, rewind, come back to it, you know, things like that. So one hundred percent. And speaking of those chapters and how you went through those chapters. Yep. ⁓ two questions right off the bat. Why are these chapters so important in understanding revelations? Mm-hmm. And then also, as we get into these chapters, you know they are Letters. Yes. Right? So why are these letters only for those churches or are they also for us too? Because I think that can be I think people kind of question when they're reading this. Yeah. So when you read when you think of the book of Revelation, you think Apocalypse, End of the World, Destruction, Fire, you know, all those kind of things. Jesus coming back. Right, exactly. And it's similar to when you read the gospels and you start in Matthew and you see a list of names and you're like Boring, like let's skip that and get to the good stuff. ⁓ you really can't, like as we talked about in season one, you really can't because that gives you, you know, the lineage, this it shows like what the picture of the world is that Jesus is showing up to. For this it's the same thing. So chapter one, as we talked about last week, was like, this is who Jesus is, fully revealed, like power, might, majesty, and John's like, Who who could even stand in front of him? And then chapters two and three are talking about these seven churches. So I'll answer the the first part, which is why these seven and then what we do with it. So these seven, I think we have a map that we can pull up that if you're ⁓ watching on ⁓ YouTube or you know video that you can see this map pulled up. But I found this to be very, very helpful. So if you'd notice, these are not the only cities in what is, you know, modern day Turkey, Asia Minor, when it was being written, but and so they're not the only churches in the area either. They're not the only churches in the empire. So what what's happening here is these are churches that are directly due east of Patmos, where John's writing, and it starts, if you notice, the order matters. It starts in Ephesus, which is right by the coast. Then Smyrna, which is next up, Pergamum, which is Pergamos, which is north. Then you go and you kind of see, ⁓ wait a minute, it's a cycle. Yeah. It's kind of like creating a circuit. So this letter would have been circulated around to the churches. So again, that so it's strategic. Yes. Like where he's going. And what you also see is not only this is a way to distribute this ⁓ information and this scripture, but it's a way to also say, hey, seven, you know, that number of completeness, that it begins with these seven churches, but it's really for the whole church that it's not gonna stop in Laodicea. It's not like they're not gonna spread this out further, because obviously we have it today. So Again, it's being spread. It's for all churches. It started with these seven, but it's for all churches to take this wisdom and apply it. And in some ways, where are we as a local church? ⁓ something that I challenge the church to examine is like, where where do we think we are? Are we a church of Philadelphia? Are we a church of Laodicea? Because you see that there are some overlaps, but there's a fair amount of Difference as well, where they're like, ⁓ this church, you're small, but you have you're strong. So, okay, like there's churches like that now that are you know, small, strong churches that Jesus is like, you're doing everything you're supposed to, and then other churches that are big and wealthy and Jesus like, you're lukewarm. I y you know what I mean? And there's churches everywhere in between. So in many ways, it's like if you find yourself as a church of Laodicea, You should change what you're doing. If you find yourself as a church of Philadelphia, you should be encouraged because you're doing the right things. The filter again, as we said during the sermon, and I believe we said in the first episode, was it's all about faithfulness to Jesus. Yes. How what does that look like? What's that level? It's not about size, it's not about budget, it's not about, you know, social media followers. All the things that we tend to get obsessed with in the church world and focus on, those aren't the metrics Jesus is really measuring. What he's measuring for is. Faithfulness and fruit. Yeah. And that can come at any size, any budget, you know, any but it all has to flow out of faithfulness. Yeah. So you'll see it starts with those seven and it gets circulated out. So that that's why those seven, but again, it's meant to go out into the whole world. The other thing I want to point out though, with these seven is why it's so important, is when Jesus starts talking about judgment. He starts with the church. He doesn't start with the world. He starts with the church. You all know better. Essentially. You all know. You have the word. You have the spirit of God. You all should know this. He also doesn't ⁓ compare the sins of one church to another. No. He's like, this is yours to deal with. So when he talks about sexual immorality, he's like, you deal with your sexual immorality. You deal with yours separate. Again, something else that the church does a really bad job is we tend to point out the the plank or the speck in someone else's eye, but we ignore the plank in our own. Yeah. But again, Jesus is saying, like, you deal with your sexual sin over here, you deal with your idolatry over here, you deal with your lukewarmness. Don't worry about Smyrna. Don't worry about Laodite. Like, if you're not them, you don't worry about them. You worry about you. So again, very on theme with teachings of Jesus that we did in season one. Yeah. I think so. And ⁓ I think a lot of times ⁓ churches, you know, when they read through this, at least some that I have seen, they'll read through these churches and be like, you know, this church down the street is this, this church down the street is that. Yep. It's never that. No. And that's exactly no, no. They're they're they're not doing anything wrong. Yeah, no. And so And then they'll come back and be like, But our church is doing this and this is why we're so good and blah, blah, blah. But I think it's like Pride. Pride at that point. Yeah. Yeah. Like it's pride in that. Right. And ⁓ so yeah, I thought it was a really great Right. You can be prideful as a big church, look how big we are, and we can be prideful as a small church. We're true. Only a few people can hang with us. Yeah. I've seen it both ways. And you're like, is that really the metric? Is i it's like how great you are compared to someone else? Like that's not To be found anywhere in scripture. Because I think a lot of people will look at it and be like, you know, the mega churches are are this. They're fun to pick on. But yeah, it's fun to pick on, but you're like, I've been in some small churches that have that same mindset. Exact same mindset. Yeah. Because what they say is like, ⁓ it's all about that pastor and that pastor's the only reason people go. And you're like, I've been in mega churches of twenty people and it's all about the pastor. Yeah. If that's the metric that you're picking on a mega church for Again, watch yourself. Yeah. Like again, it's about faithfulness. I yeah. Again, you and I've been in churches where ten thousand, twenty thousand in person church. Yep. Incredibly faithful. Correct. Incredibly faithful to the word. And they've been blessed and they can do things that other church can't. We've also been in churches of ten or twenty people. Incredibly faithful. It's not about pride, it's about faithfulness. Yep. That that is it. And you have it on no matter the size. Yeah. Yeah. And no matter what is going on. ⁓ inside of your church because I think as you read these two chapters and so everyone knows we're in Revelations two, ⁓ chapter two and and chapter three. Yep. as you read, they'll a lot of times you'll see that Jesus complements their works. You know, and yes, yeah. We said that on Sunday that it starts with an introduction of who Jesus is. Mm-hmm. The one who holds the seven spirits, the one who's the firstborn from among the dead. These different things that show not only who he is, but why he has authority to say what he's saying. And then he starts with well, just about every church, a strength they have, then a fault they have or a weakness, yeah, and then the promise. If you repent, if you turn away, or if you keep doing what you're doing, this is what you'll receive. Yeah. And those seven are all different, but kind of saying the same thing over and over. Very much so. ⁓ so we talked about how it is on us the sin is there a significance to the order of these churches? Just the fact that We talked about like the circle and and all of that and the mailing. Yeah. I I think that would be the ⁓ main argument for it is just saying like hey, like it starts with these seven but it doesn't end 'cause only one of these has a letter from Paul, yeah. Ephesus. And only one of these is ⁓ city that we even really recognize today, Philadelphia, like in America at least. So it's not like again the metric was wealth or size. Yeah. Because they're all different. And I think it shows it beautifully as you read it that you're like, ⁓ this one's good. But this is Right. It says like you are small, but you are strong. Yeah. You are looking And it's not first. Mm-hmm. You know, so it I kinda like that. But I know one thing that you did want to get into which you were not necessarily able to, ⁓ was the backstory. Of ⁓ Balaum, right? Yeah, yeah. ⁓ so Balaam is talked about in ⁓ the letter to Pergamum, it's mentioned there are some among you who hold the teachings of Balaam who taught Ballock to entice the Israelites to sin so that they ate food, sacrificed ⁓ to idols, and committed sexual immorality likewise. ⁓ yeah, so it's like you're following in that same spirit. So what does that mean? Like when we read that we're like ⁓ But like yeah, these aren't names that we recognize easily. So again, Revelation constantly references the old testament. Constantly. So this is a reference to a story in Numbers twenty two when ⁓ when Israel is traveling along in the wilderness and they're, you know, this powerful nation that's just wandering around and people are nervous about it. Yeah. And Balak, who is the king of, I believe Moab. Yeah. ⁓ he hires Balaam to curse Israel, but God prevents him from cursing him. Like he can't every time he opens his mouth, he can't curse them. So Balaam encourages ⁓ compromise instead. He's like, maybe entice them, be nice to them, make you know what I mean? Like cause them to befriend you when God said, Hey, don't do what they do. They're like, hey, the only way you can't beat them, you can't fight ⁓ and you can't curse them because God won't let me. Let's get them to compromise. Well, how was the way they got ⁓ to compromise? They're like, take some of our women, aren't they beautiful? Wed them, you know, raise family with them, you know, be unevenly yoked in many ways. It gets talked about later. So ⁓ so Jesus is using i i it's a reminder that Israel is often misled. By idolatry and immorality. Yeah. This is why God over and over in the Old Testament just gets so heartbroken because it seems like Israel does good for a season. They have a good king, they have faithfulness to Yahweh. Yeah. And then they get comfortable. Yeah. And they forget who is the one that saves them from their sin, the one who prevents all this destruction, and is the one who's really holding their nation together, who's in charge. And they're we we can dabble and compromise and ⁓ it's okay. We can have Yahweh and Ball. We can have a different idol and they always lead you away into immorality. So Jesus is saying, Hey, don't be like that. Yeah, don't do that. Don't don't bow down to something other than me. Yeah. And again, we can insert Yeah, like what does it look like today? ⁓ today it's it's obvious. Like it's ⁓ It's politics, it's money, it's power, it's sex, it's the idea of success. Like there are so many things that you're like, bow down and worship this. I mean, insert whatever your own God is, other than Jesus. Mm-hmm. What ⁓ as ⁓ Tim Keller once said, ⁓ him or his wife said, an idol is whatever you think that if you lost it, you would lose everything. Even a good thing. If you lost it, you feel like you lost everything. Yeah. So like if you lost your job, who am I? Lost your money, who am I now? Yeah. But I'm a churchgoer. Yeah, but you lost your money and you felt like you fell apart. You see what I mean? Like it's ev it's not necessarily inherently evil vices. It's anything that's on the throne of your heart other than God. So I mean they had their own in the first century. Yeah. Just turn on social media or the news and you can figure out really quick What our countries are. Yeah. And what our personal one is. Yeah. Like when you watch the news, if you get, you know, ⁓ like mad or angry about a certain thing or this or that. Or think someone is beyond reconciliation or forgiveness of God. They are pure evil incarnate. Yeah, then. Yeah. Yeah, which is really good. ⁓ yeah, they there's a ⁓ because again, like the devil He he he's sneaky. As we talked about in season one. Yeah. He started when he tempted Jesus was with bread, a good thing. Yep. Then it was to be impressive, you know, throw yourself off, everyone talk about you. Then he came out and said, I'll give you all the powers of the world. But it's all compromise. Yeah. Nowhere does he say until the very end, bow down and worship only me. Yeah. At first it's You know, if you are the Son of God, turn these stones into bread. ⁓ Nowhere does it say worship me and I'll give you bread. No. It's very small. It's very, very small. It's the slow. It's it's the ⁓ boiling of the frog. You know what I mean? Just little by little. Again, it's like anything other than Jesus on the throne of your heart, or even sharing the throne of your heart with Jesus, will eventually erode that. And you have to Eliminate it. Yeah. And I know s some of the big questions ⁓ probably on people's mind this week and you kinda set it up there ⁓ was about this Jezebel spirit. Yeah. I know it's a word that is thrown out there. Especially today in a lot of places. Yep. And typically about women. Yep. Tends to be pretty sexist. Yep, about women. ⁓ And I know up there you announced that, like well we're gonna talk more about this. Yep, yep. Because I think it is something that ⁓ which I'll just let you describe it. ⁓ but it is thrown out there many many, many, many places. Yeah, it comes up ⁓ more and more through the book of Revelation too. So Jezebel is talked about in in the seven letters and It's not a person sitting in the congregation. I did want to make that clear. Because you read that and you're like, ⁓ that w he c Jesus says that woman Jezebel. It's not like he's calling out one specific lady in the congregation. You're like, people are ⁓ I know that one. Yeah, exactly. It's like he's calling out what's known as the spirit, the Jezebel spirit. Yeah. But Jezebel was a real person. ⁓ now it's a much longer podcast to go into demonic, non demon like versus just someone who is following the flesh and Causing others to do that as well. That's a much longer conversation. But Jezebel is a real person. She was the daughter of a neighboring kingdom in ancient Israel who married the king of Israel, Ahab, and Ahab was a a wicked king, and he was heavily influenced by his wife to not only reject God, but to worship her God, Baal, instead. And Baal is a Horrible God, like demands horrible things of ⁓ his worshippers. And there's a famous showdown between probably I mean, it is the top prophet of Elijah versus ⁓ Ball, where it's the famous scene where Elijah, the one prophet of God versus several hundred prophets of Baal, and they are ⁓ the prophets of Baal are like trying to get this wood pile to catch on fire, showing that Baal is, you know, their God. Yeah. And they're screaming and cutting themselves and dancing around for hours and hours and hours and nothing happens. Yeah, it's insanity. And ⁓ and Elijah stands up next to his wood pile and says, Hey, douse water on it, like a ton of water. And then fire falls down from heaven. Yeah. consumes it like li it says like licks up all of the water. Yes. But there's a crowd on Mount Carmel watching this showdown. Yeah. And they're like, ⁓ okay, this is this is the God. This is Yahweh. This is like a reminder of who he is. Yes. but Jezebel is furious with Elijah. So she's like, I will kill you. And so he flees into the wilderness. But again, it's the idea of it's a spirit Again, I I'm talking spirit, not maybe even literal spirit, but this like when we say the spirit of a city is you know, or the spirit of a ch you know, I mean just kind of the idea, the culture, the feeling around it. Jezebel, well, may or may not be demonic spirit again, another podcast, another time. Yep. But it's the idea that you operate through fleshly desire leading others astray. To worship something other than God, she represents in so many ways false teachings and compromise. She's like a catch-all phrase. It's like a placeholder, like compromise, Jezebel, faithfulness, Jesus. Over and over and over. And later on in the book of Revelation, you see there is Jezebel who looks beautiful and presents herself in this lovely way, but she's drinking the blood of. Of the martyrs. So she's like getting drunk on it, but she represents basically the God of the world, yeah, which is all about compromise. But then you see the most beautiful woman ⁓ and it's the church. Yes. Being presented to Jesus as his bride. Yes. So again, it's the idea of like perverting beauty, perverting what's good, twisting it, and it's an intense spiritual opposition to Jesus. So ⁓ he's like, Are you gonna be faithful to me? And in so doing become beautiful, become the bride of Christ, or will you give in to destruction, to a false God, to compromise, I mean, insert whatever pornography, yeah, infidelity, yeah. ⁓ looking at a woman with lust, as Jesus put it, but it's not just sexual, it could be power. Yeah. You think the way to make change is only through politics and not through service, y you think that you need to have a a huge bank account in order to be important in a success. Like it's again anything that runs counter to the teachings of Jesus and the heart of Jesus, it gets used throughout the book of Revelation to say, you're marked with Jezebel, you're marked with Christ. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And I think you see a lot of those parallels today. ⁓ yeah. And I you know it's well it it makes the world a lot more black and white. Yeah. But not in the ways that we think. We think blank black and white left and right or but it's more of like Jesus or anything else. Yeah. Yeah. And I think too, ⁓ you hit on it ⁓ right up front is that it was it's used for ⁓ women a lot. Right. Because you can you yeah, let me y that was why I wanted to actually speak on that a little more. Is a lot of times ⁓ it's been used by specifically male dominated churches, denominations to say if a woman speaks up Yes. ⁓ speaks her mind. Yes. Or wears, you know, maybe clothing that not even provocative, but by that denomination or that church's standards would say like wicked. Yeah. Yeah. That you know, we're like, no. it's a way to be oppressive and say, hey, get back in line, remember your place. Yeah. And again, that's not the spirit of Christ at all. Because again, one of the main reasons Why we know the gospels are true was the way that Jesus not only surrounded himself with men and women, but the first ⁓ evangelists who told the good news about Jesus alive were women. In that culture, to say, ⁓ the testimony of someone being alive was from a woman would have not held any sway in court. No. No. Even to about five hundred year even probably two hundred years ago in our country, as a woman, you could not be in a courtroom and speak unless either your father or your husband was present. Yeah. I mean And gave you permission to do so. So like yeah, Jesus is like No, I want them to speak. I they are human beings. Yeah. So but it could be easily twisted to say, You have a Jezebel spirit because you're questioning male leadership. Yeah. You're like, No. ⁓ we're fighting for dignity and we're fighting to be treated as daughters of the king, which we are, but you can again see where it becomes a power play. Yeah, a hundred percent. And I think too a good thing with just going back to that, ⁓ that when it was when they wrote that the women are were the first ones to evangelize and say the good news, again, d just to hit on it even more, is they would have been laughed at. Yes. And almost like Killed for saying something like that. Yep. I believe there was the I think this is exactly how the prayer went, but there was a prayer that I mean this is wild, but like that people would pray ⁓ even before the time of Jesus was like, God, thank you for not making me a slave, a dog, or a woman. Yeah. Yeah. You know what I mean? Like that's wild. And so when Paul writes there is ne neither Jew nor Gentile, slave or free, man or woman, he's not promoting any Transgender. You know what I mean? None of that. He's saying you treat your wife, you treat your daughter, you treat your sister or the woman in your congregation same as you would treat anyone else. Yeah. Because they're made in the Imago Day. A hundred percent. And ⁓ you know, I I think ⁓ a lot of you know, the Jezebel with the evil and everything, it brings us to this. Yeah. Where Jesus says we're Satan's throne Is. Mm-hmm. Yep. And then another point he calls it the synagogue of Satan. Yes. So the hear word synagogue and you hear the word Satan with the modern things happening right now, your imagination can be off to the races pretty quick. And you know, a a lot of times in the Bible, ⁓ it's not necessarily Satan, it could be the evil one, it could be this. So this is where it's like two times like it's coming out saying Satan. Yeah, right. And ⁓ just for the the nerds to remember, Satan is not a name, it's a title. Exactly. The Satan, yes, which means the deceiver, the hostile one, as Tim Mackey likes to describe it. He said that probably is how the Hebrew the hostile one. The hostile. So ⁓ not a name, a title. So the synagogue of the hostile one. And yeah, so where it says where Satan's throne is. Yeah, yeah. So Where Satan's throne is is specifically referring to an area in that city where there was a temple that was specifically dedicated to pagan worship and worship of Caesar. Yeah. ⁓ it's interesting that when Christians, I remember reading this in my first year seminary, just like blew my mind because it was like the battle. It was like one of the big battles between not within the church, but outside the church and the Roman Empire. was that Rome ⁓ considered Christians to be atheists because they only believed in one god. Yes. So Rome had several gods. Yeah. So that was their they thought they were blasphemous because they only had one god. So they had temples set up to all these different gods. And one of the gods, similar to Egypt, thinking Pharaoh was a god, was that Caesar was a god. So the specific line that ⁓ we're going to talk about this upcoming Sunday is when ⁓ when a Caesar would come in to you know a grand entrance into a city or was addressed by a military ruler, they would say Caesar is Lord, Caesar is our Lord and God. And Christians and then you would and then in each home in the Roman Empire you would have like an image of the Caesar and you would light incense and that was your act of worship to Caesar as a god. Caesar is Lord. And what got Christians killed and persecuted more than anything is they refused to say Caesar is Lord. They said Jesus is Lord. But it's not like Christians didn't get persecuted because they were violent. The Christians were not violent. And they weren't persecuted because they didn't pay taxes. Jesus is like, give to Caesar what is Caesar, give to God what is God. They paid their taxes, they were nonviolent, and they helped people. But the Empire wouldn't help. Their threat was they didn't think Caesar was a god. Yeah. And that Jesus was the only God. So Sounds like Korea. Yeah, there's a lot of there's a lot of similarities. So What's specifically happening with the synagogue of Satan or the Temple of Satan, 'cause there's two references. The first is the temple of Satan. Is the Satan's throne and then Satan's throne, thank you. Satan's throne. So that's what's happening there is this is a particular area in this city where there is heavy pagan worship happening and worship of Caesar. Okay. But again, Jesus is saying all of that is an act of worship to someone other than me, mm-hmm and the one pulling the strings behind the scenes. Is Satan like the hostile one is like worship anything other than God. Yeah. And it's a w act of worshiping me. Yes. So that's one reference. This is the one that yeah, the synagogue of Satan is the one where ⁓ similar to Jezebel's spirit has been used and weaponized to harm people in modern day times. Yep. Just as Jezebel has been used to say, Hey, all women who are free thinking should be quieted. Yeah. ⁓ no, that's yeah you mean like that's not the that's not what the scriptures say. Same as this idea of synagogue of Satan has been used for anti Semitism. Yeah. And that's not what Jesus is saying. No. Again, what Jesus is saying is he is not attacking all Jewish people. Period point blank end of story. Like he's not. He to the very end was still trying to because we talk about season one, have the Jewish leaders turn to him You know what I mean? Repent, turn and come to me. And then where does Peter go? Pete Peter goes to the Jews. Like he goes to Jerusalem after the death, burial, and resurrection of Jesus. Paul goes to the Gentiles because they're going to all people. Yeah. Not just the Jews, but also not excluding the Jews either. Yeah. So this is referring to a specific group, this is where context matters, who was actively persecuting the church in this city. Mm-hmm. And so it was a synagogue Which is an outpost of the temple, similar to a church. So this is where the Jewish people would meet. But they had weaponized it to not worship Yahweh, but to attack Christians. They were actively turning Christians over to Rome to be killed. And again, Jesus is saying the same thing. You are acting on behalf of Satan. Like this building. was set up to worship Yahweh and you are using it to destroy the people that I am calling to my own. Yeah. It's not a mark of anti Semitism. Very, very clear on that. Jesus still wants all people, Jews, non Jews, to come to faith in him. Yes. Jesus came first to the Jews. He is a Jew. So why would he turn around and call them all satanic? Yep. Again, the acts of this area are the problem. Yes. So again, it's trying to say the black and white is not just religion, left and right. The black and right white of the world is faithfulness to Jesus or faithfulness to anything else. Yeah. It is. And I think ⁓ with those two. So you have the Jezebel and then you have the synagogue of Satan. One is used as a name and then this is used a lot as a phrase yes to them. Right. So but you can easily see, especially with the tensions today. Yes. And I know we don't have like a huge following or anything like this, but who knows? Maybe at some point this will come back to bite. But y you see the confusion today. Yeah, you do. And I have friends who are Jewish. Mm-hmm. Are like, ⁓ all of a sudden I'm the scum of the earth. Yeah. Be You know what I mean? It all gets lumped in. And this has been a problem for two thousand years, where Christians do not love their Jewish neighbors like they should. They do not witness to them as they should. In fact, they turn against people and be like, You're the ones that killed Jesus. Well, actually, friend, Paul says all of us killed Jesus. Mm-hmm. It was the Romans, Gentile, and the Jewish leaders, Jewish, all of humanity. Yeah. Him on the cross. Me included, brother. That like To to turn around and blame a group rather than look again inward. Mm-hmm. You can see how Satan's very thrilled to say, ⁓ let's divide, let's divide. They're the enemy, them, not me. Yeah. Yeah, let's do this. Let's keep going. Right. And that was a that was our fall study last year was your story has a villain talking about Ephesians five. Saying like we do not battle against flesh and blood, but against powers, principalities, ideologies. Mm-hmm. You know what I mean? Like we battle Our enemy's not people. It's it's him, it's Satan behind the scenes. So it is, and I think ⁓ you'll know the name of it. ⁓ the book that Rabbi Rabbi Tubia. ⁓ yeah. ⁓ so we had a ⁓ a rabbi ⁓ come to our church on our Seder meal ⁓ and basically walk us through what the Last Supper would have looked like for Jesus, and he did fair amount of it in Hebrew, like for the blessing and the prayer, which is really cool that yeah it was the same meal that Jesus did as his last supper was the same one that was practiced right before the Israelites left Egypt in slavery. Mm-hmm. It's it's been practiced for thousands of years now, is awesome. Yeah. But ⁓ he's part of an organization called Jews for Jesus. Yeah. Where he's Jewish, born Jewish, you know, but he believes that Jesus, Yeshua, is the Messiah. Yeah. And so he spends a lot of time in Israel ⁓ telling people like, Hey, you've read the scriptures. Have you read the Gospels, like the New Testament? You've read your Old Testament scriptures, but have you really read this? And he's like, The amount of people who are coming to faith in Israel, the amount of Jews now who are coming to faith in Jesus because they're able to really read it for themselves. Mm-hmm. He's like he described it as ⁓ the fish are coming and the nets are breaking. Yeah. Like again, Jesus' heart, he does not hate them. He loves everyone. He's trying to rescue all. Yeah. Yeah. But Christians gotta stop making it difficult for people to come into faith. Yeah, th they do. And I think sometimes we blame so many other factors on why people aren't coming. And then we could turn around and be like ⁓ I guess we are pushing people away when we do this or that or this or that. Yeah, it's the same thing I've I've said before where it's kind of like if ⁓ if the alcoholic comes into church, everyone's like, ⁓ in except faith, people are like, That's amazing, what a testimony. Yeah. the greedy person comes in and they admit, Hey, success was driving me. Yep. But what if a Hindu comes in? Mm-hmm. What if you know what I mean? Like we need to treat them the same way. It's just that we haven't normalized being around people and saying Jesus is even for them. Yeah, a hundred percent. Jesus is for yeah we tend to see it more in the suburban black and white like ⁓ Jesus saves alcoholics and greedy people and people from pornography and you know I mean like but other religions or you know I mean we just Yeah. We just Yeah i it's ⁓ it's a different it's a different thing but let's let's pivot a little bit to a fun one. Okay. Philadelphia. Philadelphia. City of brotherly love. Yes. So Philadelphia. Philadelphia is a fantastic little church, it sounds like. ⁓ it is the sixth letter that's written. And Jesus says, basically, you guys are amazing. ⁓ this is where he again references the synagogue of Satan. And as we said, the flow was Jesus introduces himself, strengths, weaknesses, promises. There's no weaknesses in Philadelphia. Yeah. They're they're a small church, but they're strong. ⁓ and so their promise is I will make you into a pillar in the new kingdom, into the new heaven. Which I don't know, in other places I joked on Sunday, I'm like, he gives a crown, you could sit down at a throne and you're like tree of life, and you're like, ⁓ Pillar. Cool. Thanks. ⁓ the pillar symbolizes not only like that because you were strong, I'll etch you into a pillar the same way that like as if it was a major contributor to a building project, you might itch their name on this is the Chase McKenzie wing of the hospital because Chase McKenzie gave two million dollars to this hospital. Like, so this is the McKenzie wing. That's what is happening with the temple. He's like You might be small, but you're so strong that I'm gonna etch your name onto a pillar. But Philadelphia was also repeatedly damaged by earthquakes. Mm-hmm. So you can imagine what gets destroyed in earthquakes are big buildings with columns and pillars and that gets fallen down. So they didn't have earthquake prevention yet. Correct. Yeah. So in a city that had experienced so much instability, the pillar You know, it symbolizes permanent stability and security. And Jesus is like, because you are built on me, no earthquake, literal, or spiritual or persecution from Rome will shake you. And you will stand the test of time into the new heaven and earth, where it's like, ⁓ this is the church of Philadelphia. They endured. They were strong. And I just think that's really I don't know, very cool that it's like if you experience natural disaster, Jesus like, I see it, I'm with you, and I'm gonna strengthen you in it. Again, just the promise of Jesus. Yeah, it's amazing. And ⁓ before we get to our closing questions and w today we'll be having ⁓ you have a new segment for us. We have a new segment, which I'll get to. But is there anything else that you are looking at that you really wanted to dive in but we couldn't? Yeah. I hit the Laodicea one pretty good in the sermon about hot and cold, but there was actual hot springs and cold water that came from surrounding cities that met in ⁓ Laodicea. Yeah. So it was like a hot springs that was about six miles away and that water would come in, but it would intersect with the cold water. So what came into the city was lukewarm. So again, where bacteria would grow, not always the best. ⁓ and that was part of again Jesus' critique, like I know you, I see you, and you're actually a lot like that water where it's you're lukewarm, so I spit you out. ⁓ probably the last thing is ⁓ there's this idea that talks about Gnosticism. Gnosticism, as I said, probably outside of the church, yeah, the biggest fight was Caesar's Lord, Jesus' Lord. Yeah. Inside the church, one of the largest fights was ⁓ Making sure the Jews and Gentiles recognize they're on the same team as long as they're on Team Jesus. Yeah. But Gnosticism was the first like church heresy that popped up. ⁓ so they're just starting to emerge. And what it is is they're taking ⁓ Greek thought and applying it to scripture. That the physical is bad. Yeah. And everything that's like mental and knowledge is good. And you're like, ⁓ we still do that today. Yes, we do. Yeah. Where people don't care take care of their body. ⁓ it it's just it's gonna go away anyways. Yeah. No, no. Jesus is very pro physical. Yeah. It's like your body in your you will have a resurrected body. Jesus had a resurrected physical body. Like the world that is to come that we'll get to is a physical, tangible world. It's not floating around in clouds. No. That's more Greek thought than it is Christian thought. Yeah. So ⁓ Gnosticism you can see is starting to come where they're saying like you need to have ⁓ secret knowledge that's not like hidden knowledge is what it stands for. So Jesus is saying like affirming the physical world. Yeah. Love the Lord your God with our your heart, soul, strength, and mind. That includes your body, your physical body. Yes. But also like Love him with your mind. Don't elevate one or the other. God made all of creation. He made all the physical. He's redeeming all the physical. So that's just the beginning signs of the first church heresy that really takes off in the second, third, fourth century. Perfect. And we still have it today. ⁓ very much. But I think, ⁓ in your notes you you wrote that it pushes back against these ideas. Yep. And it does. Yeah. But ⁓ okay, with that, we are gonna do a new segment. ⁓ I'm gonna show Pastor Sam video and it'll be on there and if you're listening to audio, you can hear it. ⁓ that Pastor Sam has not seen. Yeah, I don't know what this is. He has no idea. ⁓ so we're gonna play it and ⁓ then afterwards we're gonna get I I we just I just wanna hear your exact opinion on this. Okay. That's all I wanna hear. I'm kinda nervous, but I'm excited. So let's let's cut to the video now. Okay. So Pastor Sam, what is your reaction to this? ⁓ let's first get into it. The King James. Yeah. I I have to like really kind of think, man, that guy tired me out in like 30 seconds, is that? ⁓ there's kind of that line of like, what's the best Bible translation? The one you'll read. Yep. ⁓ I'd say within reason, there's some Bible translations I do not recommend because they've definitely altered some of the words. ⁓ King James isn't even considered that good of a translation, if I'm honest. Like from so ⁓ someone needs to tell him that King James yeah, whatever. I'm gonna leave it alone. ⁓ man. So I don't even know how to describe what that was. It it really seems like majoring in the minors and minoring in the majors and then It's a way to kinda get people fired up and then you turn around and s start railing on Jezebel and you you can get a sense that this dude's about half a second away from saying and anyone else like her. He later goes on to say it. ⁓ okay. Yeah, I was about to say I think the train the train has left the tracks and we're about to Yeah. We know where it's going. So So that is gonna be One of our ⁓ new segments where I'm gonna bring Pastor Sam a video to show him. ⁓ it could Did he really say fire me if I start preaching from anything other than King James? Very much so. And he goes on later to say someone is using the new King James, which I'm using. Yeah, which we like. and ⁓ that they should be thrown out and ⁓ no one's just sending their kids to their youth program. So that was all in the same sermon. ⁓ so Okay. But that will be our new Man's Guy selections, I guess. Sometimes it will go with the what we're talking about. Other times it's just gonna be random. But I promise you, ⁓ Pastor Sam will not see these. I Yeah, I I'm so unprepared. Yeah, we went through the whole like weekend and week and I was just finding certain videos and I did not show him, but he heard me laughing. I heard you chuckle. Yeah. So but back to the serious part before we end here. If you're if you are looking At America. Let's play this game. You're looking at America. Yeah. And you're like, you know, there's good parts, there's bad parts, there's this, there's that. Mm-hmm. But if you had to wrap it up into one big church of America, which church would you call out that that we represent? Of the seven. The one that comes to mind is Laodicea. Yep. because they they they they say, I'm rich, we're the richest s world or country in the world, we're the richest church in the world, but we don't realize how ⁓ var, you know, that we have actually fallen and we're neither hot and we're cold. I think we're coming out of that though. Yeah. I would say. I think there's been an ⁓ an awakening, not a revival, but an awakening that peop more and more people are starting to say, We want Jesus Christ. Yeah. End of story. I think that was maybe of the last few decades, but we're starting to come out of that. But I think that's where America was. ⁓ but I would say honestly maybe more like Ephesus, where it talks about we're starting to endure some hardship, ⁓ but we need to return to our first love. And I think that's the transition that's happening is you see more and more, especially with younger generations, people saying like, Jesus is what I want. Like, yes, if my church has the bells and whistles, that's cool. But if it doesn't have Jesus, I'm out. Yeah. So I I do get a sense that as the world's gotten crazier and things have become more unstable, that Laodicea is just not gonna work anymore. That I'm rich and I'm good, I'm taken care of, I have bells and whistles, that kind of like mindset. I don't think it's gonna work anymore. I think what you're seeing is people want something real, they want something that is healing and that is going to remind them of truth. Mm-hmm. And I think that is looks like return to your first love. And I think in many ways w we're moving towards an Ephesus and hopefully at some point ⁓ a Philadelphia where strong though we've endured and faithful. Yeah. And so let's play this last game. ⁓ We talked about You know how other churches will read this and then be like the church down the street, the church on this. Let's play with ours. Sure. Our church. Yeah. The point church here in Centerville, Ohio. Mm-hmm. Let's play this first one. Which one would do you think that we would represent? Mm-hmm. Then the second, if Jesus was writing a letter to us. Yeah. He's writing it right to us. Yep. What do you think he would commend and challenge at the same time? Yeah. We're not gonna get into promises cause The promises of Jesus are his promises, not us to make up. So I would say again, we're our church is in a serious transition over the last five to ten years. Yeah. I would say where we were was a church of Sardis. ⁓ there was just a lot of things that happened. Yeah. No one's really at fault, but like the church was as I told the story in dead. Mm-hmm. All intents and purposes. Like it had a good reputation, but it was dead. There was just it was COVID, leadership transition. There was just a lot that was happening and it was difficult. But people were still here. That not the people were dead. Mm-hmm. The the the ministries had just kind of collapsed. Yeah. ⁓ but there was still a remnant who was like, I think there can be something new. Yeah. So I would say probably Sardis would be the area. ⁓ where we were just from that phrase. And I think what we're really again aiming for is that Philadelphia. Like not huge, not billion or millions of dollars of budget, but faithful and strong, like having endured, ⁓ like in many ways we were shaken. Yeah. And I think that was the wake up call. Yeah. Because the question that we asked ourselves when we decided not to close our church doors was would anyone Miss us if we put a for sale sign in our yard. Would anyone care if we closed our doors? Would anyone notice? Would anyone notice? Yeah. Unless you went to this church, no one would notice. And that was like across the board. Like the city wouldn't care. Yeah. The neighborhoods wouldn't care. So that's where I say I think we were a Sardis. Now they would. It would be miss. But you know, we're still not big by many standards. Yeah. But I think what we see is just it seems like every season of our church is more faithful, more faithful, more people saying, Okay, it's not flashy, but it's faithful as best as we can. And I think we're growing in that. So ⁓ I I don't think we're there yet. Yeah. No. But I think that's our goal and that's clear and so we know what we're aiming for. Yeah. Amen to that. So with that we're gonna close out today's episode. ⁓ it should be out every Thursday is what we have decided. So ⁓ on Thursday, ⁓ in the morning. I don't know what time you get up, but it should be posted around four thirty to five AM. Mm-hmm. ⁓ and then the sermons will be coming out on Monday. So ⁓ we thank you all for tuning in and ⁓ we'll be excited to see you next week. Awesome.