(Luke 9:36-45) - Episode 32

Hey, friend, welcome to another episode of the podcast.

And this is my first time introducing it as the Sunday sit

down. So this is a great a great

chance for us to continue the conversation.

Our hope is that you continue the conversation beyond Sunday.

So as Justin has said, it's not Sunday, but we're sitting down

and we hope that you're having a good week and did get a little

bit of a chance to rest and enjoyed worship, worship

together in community, all of it.

But let me just restate something that we been saying

from the very beginning of this podcast, which is that our

conversation, while we understand, like on occasion, we

go deeper into pieces of the text that we didn't get to

include in the sermon. There is information certainly

that we want to share in this conversation with you around the

passage of this past Sunday, always the previous Sunday that

was preached on. Our hope is that we also give

you some questions that you yourself can wrestle with, and

that's why some of our questions are more application or even

like personal kind of by nature. So we really want you to find

yourself in to these conversations, not just

passively listening, but by taking it and using this to have

some further conversation yourself.

So we hope that it does encourage you and that it does

challenge you to have your own conversations.

But we're jumping into a conversation around Luke 9

versus 37 to like about 44, which is this great story.

Jesus and his disciples descending the mountain and

Jesus and the disciples immediately being confronted by

a man whose son is possessed by a demon.

He's demanding. He's begging Jesus to heal his

son. The disciples can't do it.

There's this great moment of healing and also teaching.

Jesus rebukes. He says some harsh things about

those present. So like a lot to work through

for sure in a short amount of time, but we have a couple of

questions that we really hope, like I said, encourage you to go

a little bit deeper in your own faith and with your own small

communities. One of the things that struck me

as we went into this week and, and did some, you know, did some

sermon prep as we often do, is that like this was so real time.

This was our, the kind of our Sunday after Labour Day, which

is often like everyone's back from summer and all that kind of

stuff. And so it felt like, man, this

is like a bit of a hard passage, like everyone's coming back.

Yeah. But in some ways, it was

actually just right. Yeah.

Like because you, you know, you're describing, you know, the

the mountaintop experience of the transfiguration and then the

coming down from the mountain into reality, into real life,

which is exactly what people are doing.

You know, if people have been away, if people have been on

vacation, if people have been just in different rhythms and

routines of life, they are now likely settling into getting

their kids to school and making lunches.

And I, I'm in that routine. And yeah, so are you.

Yeah. Trying to settle into it, right?

Yeah, yeah. I think the thing that I want

people hearing and so I think it's worth researching today is

that like we we tend to and I positioned the whole, you know,

descent down the mountain as that sort of crash down the

mountain that you know immediately the the pressure of

Jesus vocation, who he is, what he has been called to do.

His mission is like immediately put back on his shoulders like

it's, it's not absent up the mountain, but it's, you really

get like God's the, you know, so God the Father, this voice from

heaven, he's the primary actor in that instance.

Like Jesus isn't being demanded of by people around him.

So I think that's what I mean by, you know, like the mail to

the the pressure of it is just immediately back on his

shoulders when he comes down the mountain.

So framed it that way. The disciples come down the

mountain and immediately the pressure of being a disciple is

back on them as well. So they're kind of in the

clouds, Jesus and Moses and Elijah, God the Father voice

from heaven. And again, they're they're Peter

Blessum. He tries to act and, you know,

misses the misses the boat a little bit.

But, you know, they're, again, they're by and large, they're

witnessing this happen and they're getting to experience

that. They're going to see it.

But not a lot is being demanded of them other than their

presence. Like, they're there and then

they come down the mountain and who, you know, demands of being

a disciple. Dad's like, hey, ask the

disciples. And they couldn't do it.

So what's that about? But at the end of the sermon,

what I really tried to turn us toward is that it's not for

Jesus and for the Kingdom. It's not a crash down the

mountain as in this like failure or trial or suffering or like

just low, sort of emotional depressed down kind of moment.

It's a very intentional bringing of the presence of the God,

bringing of the presence of God down the mountain, bringing of

the Kingdom down the mountain to continue doing the Kingdom

thing. So for Jesus, it's this like

powerful move, not in any type of like coercive way, but in

this or revealed fully still more of it, right?

And I think that's the thing that I would say to myself and

to us, it can like our return can feel kind of like this

crash. The challenge is to allow Jesus

to do what he did there in our own lives.

Which is like the everyday. Monday, which is to yeah, it's

to take it exactly to take the Kingdom into the everyday

mundane stuff and really like, you know, we talk even that word

mundane, like so we talk about we talk about what is holy and

what is mundane. We talk about what is sacred and

what is secular, but that that that distinction doesn't exist

for Jesus. We didn't talk about this part

like in preparation for the podcast, but like that

distinction doesn't exist inside of Jesus.

You know, worldview. Everything is being redeemed by

the Kingdom. Yeah.

And everything is being redeemed by Jesus.

Death and resurrection and, and so you know, like for Jesus,

it's not, hey, you know, I've got office hours and you know,

my specific like healing of demons are Thursdays at like

9:00 to 11:00, right? Like it's not that type of

there's no distinction. So the, you know, we, we don't

talk enough about how we talk about Jesus bringing the

Kingdom. We don't actually probably talk

enough about Jesus being the Kingdom.

Yeah. So the Kingdom coming isn't

because Jesus is like lobbing little Kingdom grenades

everywhere as he goes. They're like, I pictured those,

like seed bombs, like those rogue gardeners.

Yeah, this is what's happened. I didn't know a thing about

gardening until I met my wife. And now I'm just like, I've got

all these random pieces of knowledge of very bizarre rogue

like militia gardeners who run around the city dropping little

like seed bombs into over like overly sodded grass, like Mono

cropped like beautifully looked. Like the rogue rogue gardeners?

They're rogue gardeners. There are people who go around

with like a little like seed bombs and like drop them places

and just to grow flowers, like just to grow native flowers.

That's like beautiful in its own little, like, subversive.

Way you know it's great. I got to plant some.

Flowers on the one hand I go, hey, that's like, that's a great

image. Jesus isn't just like lobbing

these Kingdom grenades. He's he's his presence is the

Kingdom come. And he like there's no

distinction between Jesus and Kingdom.

Yeah. So we like to like, we like, we

like to divide out. I think our life and, and we

talk about what is sacred and what is secular.

We talk about what you know is, is faith.

I think in some ways we struggle with this like intense

privatization of faith that's happened in Canada.

Ohe yeah. You know, certainly since like

the first Prime Minister Trudeau, who who really had this

strong line of like, and I'm not, I'm going to misquote him,

but he said that the state has no business in the bedroom of

the nation, right. And because there's this intense

privatization at that point of like human sexuality, but we've

done this, this back off like real privatization of faith.

And so then we get to compartmentalize and go my

church life, my faith life is over here and it's that's

sacred, wonderful love it very different from my work life over

here. I have to operate in this

culture. So I got to do the things of the

culture in order to just to succeed.

And so you just kind of sacrifice this, you know, in

fully integrated life for this completely disintegrated

compartmentalized life. And you see that in lots of

parts of our world. I mean, I have this very

distinct memory from many years ago in high school, someone, we

were just like out of a group of kids and we were talking about

life and something about religion came up and and someone

and someone said to this one girl, she said, oh, well, what

religion are you? And she said she just had this,

like, aghast look on her face. She was like, that is a deeply

personal question. Yeah.

And I was like, whoa. Like, because I'm like, I, you

know, growing up in the church, it was like, yeah, like, we

should just, like, wear our faith on our sleeve.

Like, that's just a part of life, right?

Yeah. But for many it is not at all.

Yeah. So you know, I think that this

what I hope for our people and like what I long for our church,

even just for myself, like for my own family, is to to consider

and think of all of life as sacred in the truest sense of

that word. Like all of it created by God,

designed, ordered by God, all of it infused with God's Spirit.

God is present in all of it, desires to be present through

all of it. And that that changes the way

you approach like making sandwiches for your kid, like

making lunch for your kid, right.

I was once challenged by a pastor friend who was asking him

some questions on, you know, the, the dynamics of being a

pastor and having a family. He had three teenage daughters

at the time. I had two now like 3 young

daughters and his line was so I was asking him about, I can't

remember the question, but you know, loving God, loving your

family, loving the church. And he's like, no, no, stop.

Grant you you, you don't get it. He's like the the way I love my

family is the way I love Jesus. Like the way I love my daughters

is the way I love Jesus. The way I love my spouse is for

he's Like the way I love my wife is the way I love Jesus.

And so I wanted to like separate them out to understand, like

tell me all the young pastor, I'm like, tell me how to do

this. Well, like, how can I love

Jesus? How can I love my family?

How can I love my church? And he's like, you wrong

question, wrong question. And I remember going, Oh yeah,

yeah, all right. Like, but that's stuck with me.

I don't remember anything else of that conversation.

It was like an hour and a half conversation.

I remember anything else except for that that very specific

like, OK, we got to think about reintegrating all this in a

little bit better of a way. So I what I long for our church

is that same kind of hey, Jesus descends the mountain and brings

the Kingdom And so we come off these moments into real life,

whatever that means. And I go man, Jesus is no less

present there than he is at church.

Oregon worship, like, you know, concert at camp, retreat, like

wherever you are you go OK, it's going to feel different.

Takes discipline, but we got to take the presence of God with us

into those quote sort of mundane places because they're not.

Yes. And I also like think that,

yeah, it just means we need to actually like actively be

looking for God in those spaces. Sometimes it's easy to presume,

you know, Well, yeah, when I'm when I'm walking my kid to

school, that's just walking my kid to school.

But if we are looking for God at work in those moments, because

we do get, you know, my daughter and I often we walk to school

and we, we get to have a little chats.

Yeah. And there's something beautiful

and holy about that, you know? Yeah.

And sometimes they're not deep at all.

Sometimes they go weirdly deep in our 5 minute.

Walk. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Which is the beauty of like classic Christian discipleship.

Hmm. Right.

Which is just that type of real lived out life experience where

you go like, hey, we're going to get groceries because we need

food to put on the table. And it's like, well, I don't

want to do that. It's like, OK, let's talk about

that, right? Like I, yeah, there's, it's a

privilege to be able to take someone along.

I mean, it's, it's an extra, it's an extraordinary privilege

to be able to take your kid along.

Just say that it's a privilege to take somebody along with you,

um, for those everyday kind of moments and use them as ways to

talk about, to talk about Jesus. Do I do it well, all the time?

Absolutely not. Yeah.

So let's just say that too. Yeah.

Cause sometimes I'm more frustrated by getting T boned by

a cart or something or I'm not paying attention and I T-bone

somebody else with the card like.

Like to hazard so did Costco or something like.

That, well, it wasn't gonna name, you know, any places

specifically. But carts are just too big.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, Justin, how else am I gonna fit my toilet

paper and all the other things? I know, I know.

All right, so let's that was a related and and great, great way

to jump into things. But a couple couple thoughts.

The first one, the first one looking at this language that

you see in here. So when Jesus, at the end of the

passage, he brings people back. He brings the disciples

particularly back to what he told them earlier in the chapter

for the first time. I'm gonna I'm gonna die.

Yeah, you know. And he says listen carefully to

what I'm about to tell you. The Son of Man is going to be

delivered into the hands of men. And they did not understand what

he meant, even though he just told them.

I, I guess maybe slightly more cryptically than he did

previously. But like, maybe it's maybe it's

hindsight for me, but like they should have been connecting some

dots. But but that's not the point.

The point is that that Jesus is, I think there's a gentle, more

gentle rebuke in here of saying, like you, you've kind of

forgotten. Like, you've kind of forgotten.

Let me help you remember. Yeah.

And so I want to talk about those two words of remembering

and forgetting. Yeah.

And particularly like, how do we, what are the ways in which

we kind of forget God? And I think more importantly,

what I, you know, think is better to focus on is how do we,

what are the ways in which we remember God?

And, and, and you know, we talked on that just a moment ago

in terms of our everyday life bringing God and everything.

But I think there's there's some more specific ways in which I

think we can remember God and I'd like to talk about that.

Of this, I think it's. Yeah, a couple of things from

Sunday from the message. We talked about how this is not

Jesus just, like, emotionally angry with the disciples.

Like, I can't believe you guys have been here.

Like how many years have we been at this and you guys still can't

get, you know, get this through your head, You know, So it's

it's not that on the one hand. And it is actually almost like,

hey, guys, get this through your heads.

Yeah, like he is, he is really trying to make sure they they're

hearing this. The language in Hebrew, it's the

term for it. Like it's a, I think I said

slang, but it's like it's a he Hebraism.

Like it's a. It's a very specific phrase that

is very common. Is it the listen carefully to

what I'm about to tell? You.

Yeah, which is functionally saying don't forget, right?

Remember this, Please don't forget this.

Uh, you know, it's like when my wife double checks I'm about to

leave the house. Like, hey, get anything else,

Please get this one thing. It's like, send me a text

message just so that I remember right.

That's what like it's, it's Jesus is saying Remember,

Remember, remember. I can't take out.

I she's like, do you remember my take out order?

No, I won't. So please please text me so that

I can remember. Yeah, absolutely.

This really is that that kind of, you know, it is that kind of

thing. So the disciples are, they're

supposed to be paying attention, I would presume they're paying

attention. And Jesus is quoting from

Deuteronomy. He's quoting from Isaiah very,

very specifically. And there's a lot of passages in

the Old Testament that point us to this same sort of cycle of,

to use your words, forgetting and remembering because that is

the language of Israel and of their relationship to God.

And you know, we've talked about this, obviously we're talking

about biblical Israel as language for the people know who

God chose throughout the Old Testament and they live out this

cycle of forgetting and remembering and forgetting and

remembering. And it's probably most seen like

I was thinking about this, it's probably most apparent in

Judges. So, so judges, the very last

line of the Book of Judges. Like haunting.

It is. I think it's the most terrifying

line 1 of the I mean, I say that about a couple, but I think it's

one of the most terrifying lines in all of Scripture.

So in in Judges 21, it's 2125. It says in those days Israel had

no king. So remember, God was meant to be

king. They had no king.

Everyone did as they saw fit. Other translations render that

everyone did what was right in their own eyes.

And and that's it's translated that way because actually

literally the word is judged. Everyone did as they judged as

they judged right And they got like, that's terrifying.

And it kind of feels like we live life in that radically

individual, um, like moral relativism where you get to

decide what is right for you and nobody can tell you that it is

wrong. And I go.

Right on. We've got a template for that

and it's one of the most like use your language.

It's one of the most haunting verses in Scripture is one of

the most terrifying things. So everyone in those days,

Israel had no king. Everyone did what was right in

their own eyes. Everyone did as they judged.

But if you look back at like throughout the book of Judges

and I just I marked 3 for us because you see it immediately

here and let me just find the the words.

So in seven, it's the Israelites did evil in the eyes of the

Lord. They forgot the Lord their God

and served the bales and the asuras.

So what we see Israel live into is this cycle of essentially

forgetting God and very specifically forgetting what God

had done immediately for them. Like forgiving, forgetting God's

deliverance, forgetting how God had delivered them from slavery

in Egypt, forgetting how God had LED them and guided them and

provided for them. Forgetting how when they were

hungry, provided food, forgetting when they needed, you

know, water, he provided like there's just this.

It's it's not just this general sort of they like were absent

minded and didn't really think of God.

It's very specific. They forgot the ways in which

God provided for them. And in doing that, what they do

is the second move of the pattern is they begin to look at

the nations around them, and they go, well, that nation has

this God, and that nation has their gods.

They're doing pretty well, and they're doing great.

Yeah, that nation has a king. We see it again, right?

Israel demands a king. And God's like, I don't think

it's gonna go the way that you want it to go there.

Like, no, we know we really want a king.

Everybody else has a king. Why can't we?

You already have a king. Well, not a real king.

Like, we want a real king. And it's almost like this

replaying of so you get Moses going up the mountain and

they're like, he's dead. Plus he's talking about a God

that we can't really see. All these other nations have

gods that they can see. Let's build something that we

can see with our own eyes because that feels closer.

And you know, so you, you get this cycle, forgetting God's

provision, his deliverance, the very real things that he had

done. And then turning and looking and

seeing these other nations, the gods that they worshipped, the

kings that they served, the ways in which they were successful in

the Israel, in Israel's eyes. And they said, we want some of

that. And so they begin worshipping

those gods. They begin serving those kings

that begin demanding for their own kings.

And what we see is this pattern of choosing then to live like

away from God and God eventually doing what God does, which is

like ameliorate the situation brings them back.

Usually it's through trouble and hardship.

And God calls them he kind of like back in some Hey, Remember,

Remember what I have done for you, which is why one of the

most common phrases throughout Israel's life is remember, hmm,

right. Many of the songs Psalms talk

about remember what God did in the time of right?

Remember how he let us out of Egypt?

Remember how he led us across dry land?

Remember how he led us through the wilderness?

Remember how he provided for us? Because it's very distinctly

when they lose sight of that very specific provision that

they start going, oh, maybe it won't happen again.

Maybe we gotta start gathering for ourselves.

Maybe we need to start stocking, storing up.

Maybe we need to start looking at other gods who can provide

different things. Like they got a lot of, you

know, something, maybe we gotta start doing our own thing.

It is it feels like there I think there's a couple a couple

little like themes to extract there that I I think are also

our own story personally and as a people is you get there is an

element of of comfort. And when you get into you know,

you've been provided for everything is good, everything

is comfortable. It becomes much easier to to not

have got it before. And so when God is not at the

forefront of your mind, it's easy.

It's easy to forget and and then secondly, there is a

discontentment as you look around you, you know, in this,

in the case of Israel, looking at the other nations, seeing

what they had and what they lacked or what the other nations

had and what they lacked. Naturally for us, I think that's

that's true, right? That is, it is.

It is easy to look around and to forget about God because we are

focused on our lack. So those are, I mean, when we

talk about what are the ways which we forget God, I think

that's. Yeah, I'm, yeah, I'm spoiling a

line for this coming sermon. But like, I think one of the one

of the main things that kills our faithfulness, spirituality,

our relationship with Jesus today is comparison, right?

And I don't think we fully understand how often we do that.

So we're talking, we're moving into this story where the

disciples are like, ah, Jesus, we don't really wanna, we don't

want to talk about your death. And you know, there is that

curious line where it's actually withheld from them, right?

Understanding of it is withheld from them.

So we've got that line to wrestle out.

But then they get into this argument about who's the

greatest. And which is about the service

level. So stupid.

Yeah, but it's like, how, how can we not, you know, reckon

with what you've just said? Jesus, let's do the most human

thing we can do. We'll compare ourselves and see

who's better. And I really do think I get

kills. Comparison kills intimacy, man.

Like it it. Comparison kills intimacy.

You know this for a relationship Like comparison kills intimacy

with spouses and comparison kills intimacy with Jesus.

So you comparing your life, your spirituality, your faith, your,

your prayer, your, your any of it it man, like I just think

that that's it's a road for killing your intimacy with Jesus

because you can go, it doesn't look like that.

It doesn't look like this. It doesn't feel like that.

I don't get this. I'm not like, you know, And

certainly this is true for pastors like their church is

bigger than our church. So like they must.

Be. What are we doing wrong?

What am? I right.

Yeah, exactly. And I go no, absolutely.

It's just this, yeah, yeah, a horrible cycle that we can get

into. So comparison for sure.

Yeah. And I think you could even

compare, like you could bring that even to material need and

possessions as well, right. Like, you know, it's easy to,

you know, my wife and I've been one for lots of walks around our

neighborhood lately and it's real easy to to start looking

and being like a wouldn't that be nice?

Cars in the driveway houses. And that's, yeah, like we try to

keep them as just fleeting, noticing rather than like a

truly like deep rooted, you know, sense of discontentment

because we, you know, we're very fortunate and blessed in our, in

our home and we, you know, yeah. But it is so easy to let that

seep in. And then become, like you said,

become discontent. Yeah, yeah.

God must be providing for them more than me.

Like we do. We fall into those, I think,

thoughts naturally. So those are some easy ways in

which we, you know, can forget God and, and what God is doing

and where God is, is active and moving.

But more to the, the positive end of things.

What are the things we can do to like to, to remember to like,

what are the, what are the practices that we can do to say

like, Hey, this is how we remember?

And and, and before I even, I'm just going to partially answer

the question before you even start loved the way on even on

Sunday. The remembrance was directly

connected to communion, right? So, so like just ripping off

that a little bit of like we are, we were we were called to

remember Jesus ends his passage was saying, remember, this is

what's going to happen. This is what's about to take

place. I am going to die, you know, And

then we jump into communion and. And it's and obviously a very

tangible reminder of of God. Yeah.

And his grace. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah.

And I think just say, I think you, you pointed that out in our

teaching prep meeting. You know, hey, this is awesome

because we're gonna go straight from, you're going to go

straight from this into communion, you know.

Well, that's the conclusion then, like fantastic, right?

Like it was just that, yeah, it was, it was a great transition

to be able to pull off and go immediately into communion, say,

hey, like in the core of our being, like our bodies get to

experience this remembering. Yeah, yeah.

Which is why it's so, it's so important to, to like, I mean, I

think it's why the scriptures say like, don't, don't neglect

this practice. Yeah.

Because it is that regular vary. And some churches have different

rhythms. Some it's monthly or quarterly

or weekly. But whatever that rhythm looks

like for, you know, for us, it's it's monthly.

That rhythm is so critical because it draws us back.

Yeah. Yeah.

OK. So I'm going to go the opposite

way. That is like, well, I don't know

if it's opposite, but very not Sacramento.

So you go immediately to the sacrament of all sacraments,

right, Like Communion, Eucharist, like all in which I

love because it is, I think to, to take that though and say we,

we practice communion, like you said, once a month for very

specific reason. And that is we think that

probably every week would be a bit much, but quarterly is not

enough. It's not at what point is

something a habit? At what point is something a

ritual? At what point is something

beneficially adding the the discipline, the routine of we're

going to do this once a month. You know, I summer we're a

little bit more flexible I get, but you know, September through

to June, you're gonna get communion once a month and it's

gonna be on the 1st Sunday of the month, barring any major

something. Yeah, right.

Like that's like Christmas Day. We maybe wouldn't, I don't know,

maybe we would, but it's that that level of discipline I think

is required for us to say together, let's remember, let's

remember. And it is frequently enough that

it serves that function of constantly calling us back to

the presence of Jesus. Like constantly calling us back

to the table is a constant reminder of Jesus's death and

his resurrection and his presence through the Holy

Spirit. So how can we take that as like,

you know, sacrament and then think, all right, week to week I

go, that's the place of worship for many of us, right?

And worship, I think the the community gathering to lift high

the name of Jesus, to sing, to read scripture, to pray

together, to have coffee and tea.

You know that that intentional gathering is a constant reminder

of the death and resurrection of Jesus and the continuing

presence through the Holy Spirit.

And that's why I think it's so like, I, I hope I'm the last

person to guilt people into coming to church.

Like, hey, where were you? You weren't here, I though.

Like I genuinely believe that making it a habit is one of the

most important things you can do and one of the certainly one of

the most important things like a family can do together.

And that's I'm not saying like be at church on Sunday because

like that's the only way to be the church.

That's not what I'm saying. But I think that there, it's the

benefit of the discipline saying I'm going to show up might not

feel it. It's like, well, I just didn't

feel like going to church. Great to get your butt there.

You probably need it most like it's it's not about it's not

about feeling it and you might leave.

You might leave going. I didn't feel that like the

music wasn't my favorite. I go great, great.

Because it's not meant to be. It's not meant like it's, it is

meant to be a discipline. It's meant to be.

It's meant to be encouraging. Yes, absolutely.

It's also meant to be challenging.

Um, but it, it's, there's a reason why, like it's, it's been

one of the central disciplines of the church since the very

beginning. So I go that.

Way it's I love that and and I think that yeah, my thought was

as you were talking, I was like, you know what like, yeah, you

you don't want it to be some just ritual that you do

mindlessly. But also like if it is that

maybe that's just the turn out to make that every week.

But it you know, like if it's if it's, you know, once every few

weeks you're like, yeah, wasn't really didn't really get

anything out of that. Like, well, that's OK, come

back. I I go to the dentist I don't

love. It I don't get anything out of

this. I do not enjoy it, but I know I

need to do it. Yeah, now I hope that coming to

church is not like going to the dentist every single Sunday.

No, like no drilling noises but. But I'm just saying like, yeah,

I'm just saying like it's OK if on occasion you're like, it

doesn't feel like the most wonderful thing in your life

right now. Like it just to say like you

don't need to feel it in order to go.

You don't need to feel it. Can I say I'm gonna get real

vulnerable here? OK, I'm, I'm, I'm on staff at

the church and sometimes I feel that way.

Yeah. Wow.

That's amazing. That that like there are

sometimes when it's like and it's like Sundays done.

Oh, sorry, relief, OK, you know, and then others where it's like

that was a joy. I am so grateful for this

community and this place and yeah, yeah, yeah.

So now would you say that you can also notice though, Is there

like a felt experience when you do walk away and go man, I was

not feeling it today but I'm glad I went cause like I would

articulate that. But I've had, yeah, I've had

that. I've had that sometimes,

sometimes during times like I was not feeling out today and

I'm glad it's over. You know, part I think about

like even a couple weeks ago, I was running on like 3 hours of

sleep and was and was a zombie and I was not, my head was not

in the game. And and I walked away being

like, yeah, that I don't feel good about anything right now,

you know? It doesn't need to sleep.

I just need. And I had a great nap that

afternoon. Yeah.

Where whereas like yesterday, like I walked away being like

that. I feel so full right now and in

the best of ways, you know? Yeah.

Yeah, I would articulate that as well.

I think there are, there are moments that I can look back on

and go, yeah, I, you know, I was not feeling it wasn't, you know,

waking up super excited to go and then walked away feeling

like there's no other place I needed to be.

I could have been like, I had to be here.

And like, I can see that pattern all through my life growing up,

like growing up going to church, ironically on occasion felt like

work, like growing up kid of a pastor and I go, I got it.

I guess I gotta be there. And, you know, yeah, I, I, I

can, I can certainly, yeah. I can point at every stage of my

life. I can point out moments where I

go, yeah, I didn't wanna be there, Didn't wanna go, but

that's the place that Jesus needed me to be.

And usually for for reason I go. I I wouldn't have expected that

to happen. I wouldn't have been able to

name this. OK, So take it one step further

away. So we've got sacrament, we've

got worship, which still feels like, hey, super churchy answer,

right? Number one thing I wish people

did every single day. And I say that because the

number one thing I wish I did every day and I don't is do

essentially what the Psalms do, which is to write down the

things I want to remember. So that I mean, you know, I, I

don't write songs, but like, maybe somebody writes songs,

maybe somebody writes poetry, maybe you journal, maybe you

just get it on paper. I think we miss out on what God

is doing, and I think we miss remembering simply because we

don't choose to remember. We're not, we're not reflecting

enough. And yeah, you know, like there's

a, there's a, a practice that goes obviously it's, it's a very

like widely mentioned practice, the practice of gratitude,

right? Which is, which is like on a

surface level, Christian or not Christian, great thing to do to

just be grateful. But I think actually the, the

way that a Christian could could take that practice and and make

it make it a little bit more faith centric would be to, you

know, just make, you know, in the practice is usually like

write 5 things you're grateful for.

Yeah, if you, if we did that every day in and centred it

around grateful to God for the five ways in which we are

noticing God at work, the five ways in which we are

remembering. Yeah, whatever that looks like.

I think that could be cool. OK, so here's my challenge too.

I was having a conversation with a group of guys about this and

one one person said I I've changed my language around

gratitude and it's completely changed everything for me.

And as I said, OK, tell me this is great.

The shift that he made was from Sam.

So typically when we say you are grateful for, it sounds like I

am grateful for. And you know, maybe at best we

think like I'm thankful for. And so he said the flip that he

made was thank you for, right. And so unit does like it shifts

the subject like it's less about I am thankful that these things

happened, right? Like I'm still the key player

and it pushes it out to be like, no God, thank you for this.

Because what it can then sound like is.

Thank you for situation that you know was that was was painful.

Or situation that taught me how to or for a person who I never

expected would or for like it, it pushes it back on God and

others, which is the place where like gratitude should exist out

there, like toward others. And anyways, it's changed the

way I try to think about it now. I love that come wrestling it

out. So yeah, instead of I'm grateful

for, I'm thankful for. Thank you God for this.

That's different. I play it out with people too,

right? Hey, I'm grateful that you did.

Sounds a whole lot different than Justin.

Thank you for. Right.

Like, it's just a very subtle but significant shift.

I like that. Yeah.

So I wish people wrote down. And that's what I mean, that's

why so much of Scripture is so rich, because these are people

wrestling out how to remember what God did generation after

generation after generation. So write it down.

And I also think we need to remember, ironically, no pun

intended, like we need to remember how to tell stories.

I think we have lost some sense of like this collective

storytelling as a community where I remember thinking one

day, like, man, we've got the greatest story on earth, Like

the greatest story that's ever been told is written in these

pages, and we stink at telling. It's very often it's reductive.

And you know, we, we truncate the gospel, we, we don't tell

the obviously that's a, it's a large story.

So it's, there's a lot to tell. But no, I agree.

I agree that we have not always shared this incredible story in

a compelling way. Right.

So it's like I think about some of my favorite authors over the

years, and they go like, Tolkens telling the story in this

compelling way, right? CS Lewis tells the story in

these beautifully compelling ways.

I remember it hit me when I read like, I think it was Harry

Potter for the first time, which like, when we were growing up, I

remember like, there were debates in churches about

whether you could let your kid read Harry Potter or not.

Like we won't go down that. Those debates are still

happening for different reasons, probably.

I guess, but at any rate, I remember getting to the end of

it and spoiler alert if you haven't read the last one, I'm

like really this? Is it the best you could come up

with after seven books is that Harry dies and is resurrected?

Like that's the best we've got. And so I remember to hit hit me

like that for the first time when I was a kid reading that

book. What we doing?

We still stink at telling the story.

All just telling the story is better than we do.

So I think we need to like recapture what it's like to tell

the story of the gospel. It's really cool.

What, You know, I haven't watched too much of the Chosen,

but I think there are people out there who are trying to

recapture communal, like, what it means to be a community that

tells story. Yeah.

And that does it well and in compelling ways for 2025.

That's good. So hopefully those are some,

some good practices to consider and and as we talk about

remembering and for and hopefully not forgetting what

God has done. One other one other thought

connected to this passage. And you, you alluded this a

little bit in the sermon when, when Jesus rebukes the people

present. And, and we had, you know, we

admit that we, we don't know exactly, You know, it seemed

like it was a general statement, but you mentioned that in the

disciples would have felt it particularly hard.

But you know, these words of correction.

And then you, yeah, you mentioned that sometimes our

temptation is to, you know, rail against the, the, the evils of,

of the world in the same way that Jesus, you know, you, you

wicked and perverse generation. And and, and so the question

that came to my mind was, OK, I, I hear that and I agree with

that. And yet we talk a lot as

Christians about becoming like Jesus and so OHS, where's

where's the line? Where, where is the line?

Because I mean, I, I don't feel, I don't, I don't feel great

about like talking to people like that.

Personally, that's my little bit of my personality as well, but

yeah. Yeah.

So this, this is this is where that language of becoming like

Jesus, I wanna say, falls apart a little bit.

Yeah. Because we're not Jesus.

Right, right, right. At the same time, one of them

like that, I believe that's the language of Scripture.

I believe that's the language that Jesus uses.

I believe that that's the language of discipleship is

about becoming more like Jesus and learning to do these things

that Jesus did. I definitely, you know, like I

resonate with a lot of what Dallas Willard wrote on that

language around discipleship. Ironically, not staged because I

didn't put these books up there. Willard's The Divine Conspiracy

on Discipleship is up on that bookshelf behind Justin.

So little plug. Yeah.

Anyways, I I definitely think that that language has merit and

it has limitation. So this is probably where we see

limitation of it. Now we, yeah, I, I think the

distinction that I hope to embody and that I hope for our

church to embody is the difference between being judging

and being judgmental. Hmm.

Right. So in I think it was, it was a

while ago now. It was like 2013, 2012, 2014,

somewhere around there. Barna Research Organization did

this study of Christians, self-proclaimed Christians, and

found that their attitudes and actions were more closely

aligned with the attitudes and actions of the Pharisees, right

then they were aligned with the attitudes and actions of Jesus.

So, so majority close. I think it was like 51% or

something. So it's like close but still.

But not great. That's not great.

Close closer aligned with attitudes and actions that are

judgmental to use that hypocritical.

Placing an undue burden and expectation on people.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, unloving, insensitive,

those those types of things. And I definitely think that we

can, yeah, as human beings, like we can tip into those categories

here. I do think that what what Jesus

is not doing is he's not like he as as as vague as this language

is. This is Jesus teaching, and this

is Jesus using language of the past to remind those who are

present of the cycle that many of them, like historically,

culturally, religiously, could identify with.

Like they're the ones still wrestling these things out.

You could even argue, I think, that that at this moment in

time, as Israel, you know, occupied by the by Roman rule,

they are maybe in a season of forgetfulness.

Yeah. And of being called back, yes,

right. Like that's what happens, right?

Like is, is Israel winds up in these moments and it's through

those hardships that they're kind of like reoriented back

toward God and this thing like this is the moment, this is it.

Don't forget, don't let it pass you by.

Like right here it is. So he doesn't run around calling

everybody wicked and perverse. Yeah.

So, you know, I think that, um, we, we in this, we are like we

are, we are called to be like Jesus in that we are judging of

the times. Discerning.

Discerning. Be aware.

Don't do what's right in your own eyes.

You know, necessarily all the time.

And Christians are called, I think, to have this different

lens with which we approach the entirety of the world, I said.

I said that we as Christians are naturally, we contend to want to

do that. And so I just think it's worth

saying that's not what Jesus is doing here.

Yeah, Jesus is. An it's an insider conversation.

It is. So it's going to say he's

speaking to his disciples, He's speaking to the crowds those

have gathered. So now this would be closer to

like a church gathering around and saying, hey, we need to

remember, yeah, right. I might not use this exact

language, right? But but there could be an

intensity at times, like there. And I think that sometimes a

harsh word is going to be a harsh word.

But sometimes we need that. Yeah, sometimes I need that you.

Know like I do think that there is there is a place for rebuke.

Yeah. Right.

What I wish Christians understood more, myself

included, is we need to earn the right to be heard.

And Jesus had earned the right to be heard.

Yes. Right, so he he does what he he

what only he can do. Hmm.

But I think that, like, that's the thing I wish that we

wrestled with more is, you know, we, we want to stand and like,

judge what's going on. I think almost like as a way of

distancing ourselves from it and just like declaring, like, whoa,

what's going on over there? Don't love.

I'm gonna be over here. It's more comfortable for me to

be over here. It's cleaner.

Like, if I can just completely separate myself, you know, maybe

I can even blame what's going on for my own problems.

Like, why? Like, man, like why is the

church in North America in decline?

Oh, that's secularism. Like that's like we just, we

like blame, like just kind of shipping blame, right?

And so I think that that's, that's part of it.

You know, maybe, maybe we don't want to be confronted with our

own stuff. And so we find it's, it's, I

think maybe this is the number one reason why we do it.

If I can concern myself with other people's spirituality and

where they have or are failing in my eyes, then I don't have to

look introspectively like I don't need to allowed Jesus to

confront me. If like what Jesus is using me

to confront everybody else, that must mean that I've got it

figured out. And I say that like a little bit

tongue in cheek, but I think it's easier for me to point out

a flaw in somebody else than for me to address that same flaw in

myself. It's one of my biggest

challenges when I see someone, you know, yelling at passersby

on a street corner just because I'm like, I mean, a, you're not

really helping anything. But also like that's not really

the job of of a Christian, you know, like I was, we were

talking about this before we pushed record.

But just looking up this, this passage in First Corinthians

where there's this super intense situation that we don't need to

get into and you can read about. But the Paul, his his like take

away at the very end is what business is it of mine to judge

those outside the church? Yeah, Are you not to judge those

inside? And and like implication being,

yeah, that that there is that there is judgment and

discernment to happen within, you know, with within those in

the walls. But that what business is it of

mine, you know, like that like that's not my purview, right.

And it really wasn't Jesus either.

Yeah, the thing that I love about how Paul writes all of

what he does in the New Testament is for Paul, there's

not a whole lot that has greater importance than the unity of the

church. Hmm.

So when you look at all of his writings, it's, yeah, you know,

where, where he, he, he gets harsh, harsh with the church in

Galatia. So he he, he calls them foolish,

says you foolish Galatians who's bewitched you.

I mean foolish, that's a very like in their language has a

very intense. Sure.

That's to write that down, like to send that is in like that in

a letter is not. That's not a simple thing.

I mean, if I sent that to somebody by e-mail, chances are

they're going to be offended if I started an e-mail, like, yeah,

you foolish person who's bewitched you, Nobody's nobody's

reading that. Then going oht Yeah, you know

what? They're right.

Yeah, I'm glad. Like that's gonna land.

It's hard. Oftentimes what he what he is

articulating is that the unity of the Church matters typically

more than, you know, topic AB or C because of the way we are

perceived by those outside the church.

So, like, the simplest way I can put this is like, if we can't

even get along, who's gonna wanna look at that and go, well,

I want in. Yeah, that's right.

And, you know, like, they got more mess than than we do.

Yeah. Like what?

So in a certain way like this, certainly I want people thinking

like, the church is not a perfect place.

We're not. And certainly we should not just

put on the face of being perfect.

That's not what I'm saying. But like, I love this heart for

Paul. Paul, listen, Paul does in case

like, I don't care about what they're doing over there.

He's like, you guys get your head.

Screwed that all problems here, let's deal with them so that.

The message of the gospel continues to go out from the kid

like he's like, it's, it's not just that you look good.

It's not just that you feel good.

It's not just that you can get your reward in heaven.

It's so that the message of Jesus can continue to be

proclaimed through the church That that for him is like the

number one base priority that the gospel, like the the message

of Jesus is being lived out in a way such that it spreads through

the church. And he's like, we're going to

sacrifice some things to make sure that one main thing

happens, right? So unity for one.

He's like, hey, we are going to choose to be united for the sake

of the Kingdom and for the sake of the gospel and the message of

Jesus being spread, not because it's easy and comfortable and

makes us feel great. We're going to have awkward

conversations and hard conversations like hey, adult

men, you probably don't need to worry about getting circumcised

like awkward conversations about how to get along inside of

community. So for him it's it's about

understanding that why to use like Simon Cynic's language of

getting back to why. Start with why, yeah.

For us, it needs to be the same. You know, it needs like a one

priority needs to be that the message of Jesus is blowing up

beyond these walls. And and and not, not hindered by

our own stupidity. Yeah.

And that's what we see. I mean, we we really do.

And this is a hard word as just as we wrap up, but like it's a

challenge that we need to face that like there are there are

eyes on Christians and churches and and they see the ways in

which, you know, the churches functioning in, let's say, North

America, just as an example. Yeah, because it is still fairly

predominant and not always in good or healthy or or or helpful

ways. And by that I just mean like the

sometimes our our witness has been really bad.

Yeah, just to be very crystal clear.

Yeah. And and that doesn't help us to

be able to talk with our with our friends about Christ.

Yeah, so, OK, let's circle back all the way to 45 years

anniversary. Hmm, right.

It's not 50, it's not 100. It's not like 45 is 45.

It's longer than you and I have been alive.

Super significant anniversary for our church, like planted 45

years ago and we've talked around this idea.

I think we're entering into a little bit of like a danger zone

of we we're we're not a church plant anymore.

Hmm. Like this is our third iteration

of building. So yeah, planted here as a

rental. Well, this was a school, built a

building, came back, bought this school when it was closed as a

school, kind of ran out of it. And God did some amazing things

through all of that story. The the danger that we're into

is we're now far enough away from that original like church

planting spirit of like we are. We're gonna plant a church in

this part of Guelph because we believe that there are people

and families here who need to know Jesus, and we're gonna

provide that Christian witness here.

We're called to be rooted here and to be the church here and to

see the message of Jesus spread throughout our city.

And, you know, we're reaching a time where we still have some

folks who are around when the church was planted not but not

many. And there will come a day when

there are no more people around who were there when we were

planted. And we run the risk of I think

in these next years going, are we going to idolize the past in

a in an unhealthy way where we say, you know, we cannot do

certain things because this is, you know, this is how it was

started or why? Or are we gonna elevate the

beautiful mission and witness of those first planters and that

early church and say, hey, here's the Spirit and here was

the here's the mission. We're going to be crystal clear

that the mission really hasn't changed, but our methods need

to. Yeah, yeah.

And we were pretty clear on that when we when we were working

reworking our vision and mission statements that like, hey, like

we don't want to get caught up in methods because methods

change as as generations come and go, right.

And so we have, we, we want to be able to think that through

in, in a way that I mean, obviously there's lots of,

there's gonna be hard, you know, I'm sure they'll be hard

conversations because we become attached to certain ways of life

and being. And, and I, I do too.

We all do. And, and so, yeah, it's going to

be really interesting. I'm looking for.

I'm looking forward to. It I just think we have we have

a beautiful opportunity to honor the the.

People who have come before us. Yeah, right.

And on whose shoulders we stand. And to say the best way we can

honor what they've done and accomplished is by ensuring that

it's here for another 45 years. Hmm.

And another 45 after that. Yeah.

So, yeah. Remember, tell the stories,

write things down. Come to church, take communion,

do the things. Love that.