Podcast: The rich young ruler (Luke 18:15-30)

Hey, friend, welcome to another episode of the podcast.

Whether you are watching or listening, whether you are in

your car, in your home, we're glad that you're here and we

hope that our conversations help you have your own conversations.

We're jumping into the Rich young ruler.

So we're working our way through Luke.

We're in Luke 18 still. We're going to be here for one

more week, one more week in 18 and then we'll be through.

But rich young ruler comes to Jesus, asks Jesus this great

question. What must I do to inherit

eternal life and then ends up going away sad.

So that's the teaser at the story.

Not a happy ending. Not a great ending for this

dude, but probably an honest ending.

And the in some ways air quotes here right ending.

Like he walks away being confronted by Jesus and by the

gospel for what he holds near and dear to his heart, for what

you know, his his values are. And he approaches Jesus with one

thing and with sort of his agenda.

And Jesus turns it around and this guy goes away sad because

he realizes that he's got a surrender and laid down his

agendas. So we got a lot of questions,

which is great. So thank you for your questions.

Those of you who sent questions and comments in, We're looking

forward to this conversation. So Justin, take us away.

Let's jump into these questions. Yeah.

And, and maybe just even before that, I just had like a thought

as we were, you know, as you were preaching and as as we were

preparing for, for this morning, even of just like this reminder

that, you know, so this ring you rung, you rich young ruler comes

to Jesus. And then, you know, Jesus lists

off these 10 commandments or some of the 10 commandments

which we're gonna get into in a SEC.

Yeah. And then he's like, I've kept

all these, I've done all the things.

And then Jesus, you know, what does he say?

He says you still lack one thing.

And that's kind of been reverberating for me of like,

and not in like a not in like a guilt and shame he kind of way,

but just sort of like, hey, the journey's not done, right.

That like when we think we have arrived and achieved, you know,

the work of God, God doing heart work on us is not yet done.

That was sort of like, are my big takeaways from yesterday is

just like, like, even if I think I've gotten this one area of my

life sorted out, there's going to be another.

It's a little game of whack A mole.

Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely.

Yeah. I and I think, I think the, the

thing that I want people to hear and know is like perfection

isn't the, like isn't the requirement.

And that's not sort of the, you know, one day you'll go to Jesus

and go, hey, great, perfect question and perfect execution.

You figured it all out. Great job.

You know, like that's not, that's not the end goal either.

So, you know, I think we are all in a constant native approaching

genius and having the gospel and what Jesus says confront our own

agendas and our own expectations and yeah, ways in which we are

living that like that. That is you're right.

That is a a continual thing that we will well, that we will just

experience all the way through until, as Paul says, we will,

you know, one day see fully and be known fully.

So yeah, yeah, yeah. I think it is a good reminder to

all of us. And this is what I love about

preaching is that, you know, it's a good reminder to me all

the time, which is great. Like that's just a fun place.

To be, yeah, So on the note of the 10 commandments or some of

the 10 commandments that Jesus lists.

So he comes to this man comes to Jesus, and he's like, what do I

need to do to inherit turtle life?

And Jesus lists off you shall not commit adultery, you shall

not murder, you shall not steal, you shall not give false

testimony. Honor your father and your

mother. So kind of like the I believe

it's the latter 5 of the of the 10 commandments, right?

Is that correct? And he said, And then, you know,

the guy is like, great, I've done that, you know, check Mark.

No problem. I've done.

I've kept all these since I was a boy.

Yeah, there's something that I thought about and then I'll give

credit to my wife Lindsey, who also then kind of expanded on

that as we were talking during a car ride yesterday and just

being like, hey, there's a lot of comments that he didn't

mention, you know, and, and why, why is that?

Why what's going on there? And, and it kind of felt like

you could, you could make an argument if you read through the

the first few 10 commandments that he might be guilty of some

of those, right. And, you know, even thought

about this man who had great wealth, you know, did this man

keep Sabbath or did he skirt around keeping Sabbath so that

he could keep procuring wealth? You know, like there's like

questions that come to mind that that I think are are, you know,

that that they're interesting for us to explore, but I know

that you have some other, you know, insight and thoughts as

well. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

So, OK, I'm trying to think about the best like logical way

to answer this and cover off some of the stuff that we didn't

get to in the text, like in the sermon from from the text.

So the the rich young ruler comes to Jesus and you're right.

So he asked Jesus, what must I do to inherit eternal life?

I actually want to back us up to the very beginning of his

question because all throughout this passage, and this is what,

you know, you just, you don't have time to go through every

rabbit trail in the sermon. But all the way through this

passage for a Jewish listener, there would be like alarm bells

going off or signs kind of hinting at the answer all the

way through as Jesus is speaking.

And in English, we miss what's going on.

But in, you know, it's still in Greek.

Like if you read it in Greek, you're also missing some of it.

There's cultural context. Yeah, so likely, you know, so

let's say spoken in Aramaic based on Hebrew Scripture, Jesus

has already hinted at something really, really profound here.

So the rich young ruler comes to Jesus and he says, good teacher,

what must I do to inherit eternal life?

So he addresses GS good teacher. We're like, OK, fine, cool,

whatever. Like maybe it's just sucking up

to Jesus, right. Like maybe he's just trying to

like, hey, I think you're good. And, you know, don't, don't get

angry with me. You know, in, in Matthew, the

the good is also like, what good thing must I do to inherit

eternal life? So that the good there is kind

of just moves. Yeah, yeah.

But Jesus responds, Why do you call me good?

No one is good except God alone. Which is very confusing.

Right. So like, what is Jesus just

said? Yeah, So in English it reads

like, has Jesus just said that he's not God?

Like I can. You can see well how someone

would walk away with that being a question.

And Jesus is sometimes a like kind of skirts around that, you

know, his nature in that way. So like that wouldn't be beyond

that wouldn't be beyond Jesus, but like just for him to

outright, you know, at least what you could assume or infer

from this affirmative, right, kind of say, like I'm I'm not

God, only God is good, right? You know exactly.

The opposite. That's exactly the opposite of

what he saying right. So in in Hebrew what this is

meant to sound like and what is meant to reference for a Jewish

year and listener is the Shamah hero Israel the Lord our God the

Lord is 1 and so Jesus has just said the exact opposite.

So we we hear the question and we separate Jesus and God and to

Jewish listener Jesus question has just stated they would be

they would like this is a reference to the Shima here is

there the Lord our God, the Lord is 1 and that one and good is

meant to say to this man. No, Jesus is stating that he is

God here. And so it's also so it, it,

he's, he's not saying in any way like no one is good except God

alone. And I, you know, I'm a human.

Like what he is saying is you by your own admission, have just

named me like you know that God alone, God is 1 God is good.

And so for you to say that you are naming me God and you are

naming by naming me good, you are naming me God.

So He he Jesus has already started to push against some of

this guys like expectations that he's bringing to this

conversation and and the alarm bells should be going off from

the very beginning when Jesus starts down this now list of of

commandments. So.

Yeah, it was. Is he just sort of treating him

like a like a rabbi? Is that like when you're good

teacher? Is that sort of like what he's

trying to do? Yeah, I think so.

Like this is a common question posed to Jewish teachers like

the rabbis. Yeah.

OK. But you know, there is there's

the good teacher is a it's an odd address.

So that that that is not a typical address to a rabbi.

So something is going on here. So for this man to come and say

good teacher, that's not a we hear that as like a sure, it's

maybe a typical address. It's not it's not that wouldn't

have been a common address. So something different is

happening. There is something subtly

different I. Don't refer to you as good

pastor or you know that would be.

Weird. That would be weird.

So what are you trying to get? What are you trying to like?

What you trying to convince? So.

So we've got this guy, he's come to Jesus.

He's a good teacher. Jesus has just reminded him of

the Shamah like he's reminded him.

Uh, and then flips into these like, why do you call me good?

No one is good except for God. Like remember and now you know

the commandments do not commit adultery, right?

Do not murder, do not steal, do not bear false witness and on

your father, mother. So those five now to get the

heart like the like the heart of this question is why these 5.

So Jesus is inferring, I think to this man all of the

commandments by listing these five O again in in Jesus's day,

it was commonly understood that these five in order to keep

these five commandments, you would also necessarily be

keeping the 1st 5. So when you flip over to Exodus

20 and you read the commandments, it begins.

God spoke all these words saying, I am the Lord your God,

who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the House of

slavery. You shall have no other gods

before me. And in many ways, Jesus has

started his answer in a very similar fashion, right?

Why do you call me good? No one is good except God alone.

I'm the Lord your God, and then he goes into the in the

commandments in Exodus 20. You shall have no other gods

before me. You shall not make yourselves

carved images or any likeness of anything that is heaven above

the earth beneath. So no graven images.

You shall not bow down to them or serve them.

Do not worship them right. I'm the Lord your God.

I'm a jealous God. And so he continues through.

You shall not take the name of the Lord your God in vain.

Remember the Sabbath, keep it holy and then you can you know,

you can read through all of all of the commandments.

So in in Jesus day it was commonly understood that you by

keeping the 2nd 5 which are much more outwardly facing, it is you

are representing 2 people that you respect and honor and keep

the 1st 5 which are internally facing or they face toward God

but have much more to do with your inner life, right?

So you know, first one, you should have no other gods before

me. How do you demonstrate that?

Right? So you demonstrate it by keeping

the 2nd 5 outwardly toward the world and toward other people.

So what what the implication here is?

And I think I stumbled up. I didn't check this, but I think

I stumbled on this through. So it's actually Matthews

telling of it and Matthew 19. And Stanley Hauerwas has a great

Matthew commentary. I think he talks about it, but

it was in one of the Matthew commentaries on the same passage

that that goes into the idea that that what Jesus is doing is

pressing on this guy's heart, right?

So, so he is saying to this rich young ruler by asking him or by

telling him, reminding him that he must keep the second five.

What he's really saying is you have to keep the first five.

Your heart needs to be in the right place.

So he lists these five outward facing commandments because for

all of the listeners, those five outward facing commandments

represent to the world whether your heart is in the right place

or not. And so he said, yeah, sure, I've

done all the things he's indicating to Jesus.

My heart's in the right place. And then Jesus takes it one step

deeper or further and says you still lack one thing.

What he's really saying to him is your heart is not in the

right place, and I'm going to reveal to you what your heart

really values. Go and sell all of the wealth

that you've amassed and accumulated and then come and

follow me. And so this guy's living, he's

so the, the, the Jewish, the rich young man, he's, he's

living with this kind of mathematical equation to life.

If I keep these five, if I keep these outward 5, then that shows

to the world that I'm, I'm a law observing Jew and I've kept the

first five. And by demonstrating these five

to Jesus, I'm showing Jesus that my heart is in the right place

and I'm worthy and deserving of being called a disciple and of

inheriting eternal life. It's, it's almost, I mean, it's

reminiscent of, of the way that the Pharisees have often been

approaching their faith, which is a little transactional, a

little bit like, OK, let me make sure I followed the rules to AT

and, and you know, the transactional in a way.

Yeah, it's an academic. It's an academic endeavor,

right? Like even the question, what

must I do to inherit eternal life is just a good question to

be batted around for fun. Like, you know, with no real

world consequences and Jesus saying, no, there's real world

consequences. And I'm going to start to reveal

to you where, you know, if you think it's A + B = C all the

time, like you're missing something in that simple

equation. Yeah.

And so. So like I said, like this, the

rich young ruler comes to Jesus and he says, Hey, I've done all

these things. Let me show you how good my

heart is. It's almost like the second you

start to talk about how humble you are, you're not humble any

longer, right? And, and Jesus presses him and

says, no, your, your heart is still not in the right place.

And I can see it because of your allegiance to these things.

So, uh, yeah, Why those five? It's because Jesus is using them

as like this rhetorical move to reveal to the man that his heart

is not in the right place the way he assumes it is because

he's done the right things. That's good.

That's good. I, I think, I think we have

these, I think we still, like, I think we still have these in the

church. So I, I kind of subtly hinted at

a few. Like, I think you go to church

on Sunday. Oh, my heart's in the right

place. I serve all my hearts in the

right place. Like I volunteer, I show up, I

tithe. Like, I think we've recreated

these, you know, externally facing 10 commandments for

ourselves as Christians in 2026. Like, you know, I think it's

very easy to fall into the same trap of thinking well by my

outward habits because they do listen.

Like your outward habits form and shape your heart and your

mind. Absolutely.

But you know, I think we live this base understanding that,

OK, if I do all the right things, then that must mean that

my hearts in the right place. And maybe it is and maybe it

isn't, but it's not simply because you do the right thing

and and that's what Jesus wants this guy.

So, so there I could imagine a situation where somebody comes

to Jesus and says, yeah, I do all the, I've done all these

five and just says, OK, great, you're your heart is actually in

the right place because everything else is surrendered.

But that's not the case for this guy.

And probably not for most of us. I mean, I think that we can

always find even just like internal motivations that are

are not pure, right? That that even the most moral,

upright, ethical person in the world is still going to miss the

mark in some way, which I think is again, that's you.

You touched on that like that. This is this is our need for

Jesus, right? You know, even like there's

this, there's a show that was around, you know, while back

called The Good Place that kind of dealt with a lot of like

philosophical existential stuff. But there's this one episode

that always sticks out to that sticks out for me that they talk

about like this moral ethical quandary of like you don't, you

know, the rabbit hole like a like a tomato.

OK, well, where where did this tomato come from?

Where was it grown? Was it harvested ethically by

the right people? Where, you know, like, was it,

was it brought here in gas? Because, oh boy, that's, you

know, that could be ruining the planet, right?

So you get on this rabbit hole of like every single choice make

like reverberates with 1000 different ways.

And so, like, I had like a little bit of an existential

crisis after that episode of like, thinking through every

single life choice, right? So we see you growing tomatoes

in your front yard this year. That's why backyard, but yes, OK

and and that's my wife and daughter.

That's that's their job to do. I I have a strict rule that they

grow, I cook. That's that's the plan.

So, yeah, sorry we got a little sidetrack there, but I think

there's just like this idea of like, yeah, we we can all, we

can all suppose some degree of, of morality and ethics and, and

still Jesus can still say there's still something you

lack. Yeah, yeah.

And so I think that's the one of the honest questions maybe to

pray through is, is to ask Jesus to start to show you the thing

that you lack. It's hard.

So here's here's the thing, like here's you start to have

sympathy for this dude, right? Like he he has, and I said this

in the sermon, he's probably spent his entire life trying to

be the right kind of person and trying to do the right things

and trying to be righteous and trying to be successful and

trying to be, you know, a quote, good person.

And you know, he still, Jesus says to him, you still lack one

thing. You're like, oh man, like poor

guy like you. We all have blind spots that we

can't see and you can't see them until somebody reveals them to

you and show like presses and actually says, Hey, this is the

blind spot. Now, then at that point, there's

a whole lot of work to do, which looks to me like he's unwilling

to do. We don't know.

Here's the other. Here's the other thing about

this this whole passage that I say scares me, but like is just

quite interesting. We don't know really what

happens to this guy. He just goes away sad and that's

all we. Know maybe he goes and thinks

about it. Who knows?

Who knows, right? And so it's not there.

All we do know is that he goes away sad because he had great

wealth. Um, and so it's it's yeah.

Did he wrestle it out? Did he not?

Probably not because it's not there.

But, you know, we just never hear of him again.

He's got this great opportunity in question to really confront

some things in his life. He doesn't do it.

And so I think, you know, we need to ask and.

And one of the questions that people can actually practically

take away, I think, from this episode is.

You know, where are you going to carve out time to ask Jesus to

start to reveal the thing to you that you lack?

What is the what's the one thing that you lack?

What is the thing that you are still lacking in this moment?

Which is super vulnerable and challenging.

And I think that it like that's like work to do you and, you

know, you and Jesus and also you and community, because sometimes

Jesus may reveal the thing and then that can get confirmed by,

you know, by community. Yeah, OK, we're good with that.

I mean, not good with it, but you know, so is continuing on in

the text. I want to kind of go like

chronologically. And then maybe toward the end,

we'll circle all the way back to the, the, the beginning of the

passage, which is like the little children.

But so Jesus talks about how hard it is for the rich gene of

the Kingdom of God. And, and then they're like,

well, how can anyone be saved then?

And Jesus says what is impossible with man is possible

with God, which just reminds us that like, hey, like we all lack

a thing. This man, this man lacked the

ability to, you know, this, this, this hold on him.

We all have things that have a hold on us.

We need God's grace, and that is the only way we are going to

enter into the Kingdom. And then Peter says it's kind of

like this little random ending. Yeah.

He's like, we've left all that. We have to follow you.

So he's like, we we did the thing.

We did the thing that that this man was unwilling to do.

And then Jesus says, truly, I tell you, no one who has left

home or wife or brother or sister or parents or children

for the sake of the Kingdom of God will fail to receive many

times as much in this age and in the age to come eternal life.

So kind of weird, like what, what does that mean?

What is, is Jesus encouraging us to, to leave our families to,

to, to do the work of the Kingdom?

And, and will if I, if I, if I leave my family for the Kingdom,

will I get, will I get more back monetarily?

Like what? What's what's happening here?

Yeah, no, I think the. Can you just just say no to

that? The take away is no, don't,

don't do that. Yeah, I, you know, I think, I

think very, very rarely would that be the case, right?

Is, is that never the case? No, I'm not, I'm not gonna say

that, but that that's not the point of this, this passage

here. So Jesus isn't giving us like

this prescription for how to live the best disciple life

possible. You know, he's not saying yeah,

he's not saying leave your family in, in that, in that way.

I think what he is saying is to a group of people who have left

everything to follow Jesus, it's going to be OK for you.

Like, like I, I actually, you know, I, I can't again, can't

remember where, where I read this, but I, I think that this

is in some ways like the most pastoral response that she could

have for his own disciples because.

Because they have. Left, they have left everything

absolutely. And so, you know, in some way.

So I think to a couple things are happening. 1 Peter asked

this question and he says see like we've left our homes and

followed you. I almost think Peter is having

this like existential crisis, right?

He's like, we've we've done the thing.

Hmm. And you've just said impossible

for man, possible for God, Like we've done this.

Help us understand what's happening.

Like, is it gonna be OK? Like, are we good?

Yeah. And I think she's saying, hey,

don't worry, Peter. Like, you know, you, you, you

are obedient and you are responding.

And there will be reward and implication for that, right?

Like there, there. That will not be for not.

It will not amount to nothing. So I do think it's a pastoral

response that Jesus is turning toward Peter and the disciples

to say, yeah, that you have and that's a decision that's worth

honoring and that's a decision that is worthwhile.

And that is a a decision that's going to lead to our life.

Like these are guys who left their livelihoods.

They left there their profession.

They walked away, some of them from their father in a boat and

followed Jesus. They are actually doing the

thing. And sometimes Jesus response to

the disciples need to be read in light of their immediate life,

like what is actually happening immediately for them.

And I think that this is one of them.

Now, as I say, 2 two things. So that's number one #2 I do

think that Jesus is highlighting the difference between the rich

young man and the disciples. So he's saying truly, he's

saying, yes, you are right. You have left and you have

sacrificed and you have given and walked away from for the

sake of the Kingdom. And that's what it does take.

Hmm. So I, I think that both of those

things can be true. I think that this is a pastoral

response for for Peter and for the disciples.

And I think that Jesus is really pressing the fact that this rich

young man is. It's not that what Jesus has

asked him to do is impossible in the sense that nobody has done

it. Like the rich young man is not

being asked to walk away from anything different than what the

disciples have already walked away from.

Yeah. And so I think Jesus does want

to press on the fact that you know, don't don't make it sound

like I've given you this, this completely impossible task to do

to respond to that should make you walk away sad that even more

so is revealing what's going on in your heart.

So the the response to just so if you know, if your response to

this is say, well, you know what you are asking of me is too

much. Therefore what you are asking

doesn't matter, I'm going to completely abandon the thing.

I think that this response is also for you because Jesus is

pointing out no, the disciples have done this, you have just is

is really affirming them. He's saying, yes, you have and

it's that is a sacrifice. And it is not easy, but it is

doable in the not in the sense of salvation, because what he's

saying very clearly is in the grand scheme of salvation, this

is impossible for you to earn. Yes, But what is possible is

your obedience. What is possible is for you to

respond. What is possible is for you to

surrender all of the things of your life that you would really

rather hold on to. What is possible is for you to

say sure, Jesus, you, you get in getting my full allegiance.

You, you get my finances, right? You get all the things that I've

amassed, they're yours. So, you know, I think he is.

He's pointing out just how in some ways foolish the rich young

man is. And again, like you got to have

sympathy for this guy. Um, but really, like what this

story is revealing is that he is choosing to walk away from a

life following Jesus for the sake of his wealth.

And man, that's that's a conversation for 2026.

Like it's sobering and also it's like it's, we're in this, you

know, you mentioned our, our year like, and, and it's, it's a

challenging situation where in, in the West there is this, it

increasing feeling of scarcity because, you know, prices have

been driven up, you know, gas, although gas price was a little

cheaper in the past couple days, but gas prices are super high.

The cost of living is, is, has skyrocketed over the past, say

five years, you know, and so there is this sense of, of

scarcity that I hear from some people that I think would maybe

have people not identify with this rich young ruler in some

way. And yet I, I think I want to

temper that by also saying like, and yet we are still so far

beyond wealthy compared to so many other parts of the world.

And so like, it's this, this double edged sword of like, man,

people, people aren't feeling rich.

A lot of people aren't feeling rich right now.

Yeah, Yeah. I think the same thing for money

goes as does pride. So, you know, I, I think that

you can have. So pride can be an issue for

you. Yeah.

Because you think 2 for everyone, but because you think

too highly of yourself, it can also be an issue when you think

too lowly of yourself because at the end of the day, you're still

making everything about you. Yeah.

Yeah. And I think that when it comes

to money, everything can be about money, whether you have

too much of it or too little of it.

And, you know, admittedly, it's, you know, a harder life maybe to

live when you have too little of it.

But I think that your allegiance can still be to something that

you lack. Right?

So like the like stereotypical American dream started with

nothing and make everything, well, money's the idle when you

have $0.00 and money's the idle when you have a million or 2

million or 10 million or billion.

Like, it doesn't the the amount doesn't matter.

I think the allegiance matters and I don't necessarily think

that the amount mattered to this guy.

I don't matter to him. I don't think that the amount

necessarily matters in terms of the implication of the story

other than to say he's he goes away very sad because he's very

wealthy. So it's just exemplifying his

love of money, right? And but I, I think that the

warning that I would give to people and to myself like this

is the warning that we all need to wrestle with.

Is that the thing? The thing that you, the thing

that you fear you lack, can also become an idol and worshiped in

the same way as someone who has too much of the thing.

Yeah. And so that like at the end of

the day, that's the danger of of money.

Same with a whole lot of other things, right?

You know you can. Ah man, you can idolize

marriage. Marriage can be your idol while

you're still single. Yes, And very often is, right.

But it's like, it's the thing. It's the thing that's gonna make

me happy. Family, kids, having kids.

It's the thing that's gonna make me happy.

It's the thing that I'm gonna find fulfillment finally, my

life, like I will have made it. And then you get there, and it

can be the thing that you idolize when you have it.

Yeah. So yeah, like this is the danger

with idols is that you don't have to have it for it to be the

idol like. And and as you're using that

word, I'm just reminded of, you know, going back all the way 10

commandments, like, hey, you know, this guy again revealing

of his heart that his heart was not fully following those first

few commandments. Yeah.

OK, so one final turn here. So you know, the this story is,

you know, largely about this, this Richmond, you rich young

ruler. It's a bit of a tongue twister,

but as you said, in all the Synoptic gospels, Matthew, Mark

and Luke, it's paired with this story of the little children

coming to Jesus. And one of the questions that

that came out, it's a beautiful story.

It's you know, it's it's it's lovely.

I mean, yeah, you're right. You can sentimental

sentimentalize it a little bit. But like so good question came

in about what is being childlike in God's eyes besides

acknowledging our dependence. So in the passage, Jesus says

the Kingdom of God belongs to such as these children don't

hinder them from coming to me. Anyone who will not receive the

Kingdom of God like a little child will never enter it.

And So what does what does a childlike faith look like?

You know, I can't imagine it would just be like liability

because I think I, I have a I I bristle at that of like, I I

don't want a naive faith. I want to deep faith.

And yet there is also like this desire for like a a childlike

faith as well. That just that that believes

that trusts that is dependent on Yeah, I don't.

Know yeah so so ironically like all of the the for all the

reasons that we sentimentalized children and faith I think what

we're seeing is the best qualities that we in some ways

are jealous of this is the interesting thing about life

man. Like when you're a kid, all you

want to be is an adult and then you're adult.

You're like, man, all I wanna be is a kid again, right?

Like we just, we have this funny relationship between stages of

life. But I do think that all of the

reasons why we sentimentalize childlike faith are still true.

Like there are, there are many good qualities about the way a

kid looks at the world with wonder and excitement and

curiosity and openness to what could be that are good.

I think that the danger is we leave it at that level.

So you what? What I really wanted to push on

Sunday was the fact that children in Jesus day had

nothing, no status and they were no good in a revolution, right?

Like, and in the disciples minds, that's what Jesus was

leading was a revolution. And in their minds at this point

still they're like, OK, at some point we're gonna have to pick

up swords and like over overthrow the government.

Like something's happening. These guys are no good to us,

right? And so like kids are just gonna

get in the way. Yeah.

And and Jesus lifts them up to this.

I said like stakeholder, shareholder position, like the

Kingdom belongs to them. And you need to learn, you adult

need to learn how to see life like these kids and how to how

to receive the Kingdom. That's the point.

Like you need to learn how to receive the Kingdom like a

child. Well, a child can't earn it, a

child can't fight for it. Like a child can only be given

the thing, and that's Jesus's main point.

You can only be given the thing. And so a childlike faith has to

start there. It has to be about our need to

receive from God the thing that we cannot earn and have no

status to attain. It is in that in that sense

about salvation. And you know, the danger is we

don't love that. And so we make it only about,

well, I need to be curious and I need to be, you know, filled

with wonder and joy and ask questions.

And you're just creating a new list.

You're literally just creating a new list of qualities that you

need to achieve in order to receive the Kingdom.

Yeah. So it has to be about

dependence, but it's it's so I think the making it entirely

about dependence also guards it from being well, kids are naive.

Like they just accept things blindly.

You tell them that something is true and and they believe it.

Well, no, it's not about that. It is literally about their

inability to do for themselves the things that only an adult

can do for them. Right.

They can't go find food. Hmm, They can't change their own

diaper. They need to be put to bed,

right? They need to be fed.

They like so. So I think that the dependence

piece guards in some way too against the against it being,

oh, well, that's just about like, that's a naive childish

faith. So childlike doesn't mean

childish, which I think is something we commonly hear

people talk about. It's not just about being naive

and it's not about having a blind faith that just accepts

without any sort of reason conversation.

You know, uh, one of my favorite like Andy Stanley quotes is

like, if you grew up in the church, you, you know, the, you

know, the, the, the song probably if you grew up in the

church as a child, at least in our era.

Jesus loves me. This I know for the Bible tells

me so. Yeah.

And his whole argument is most adults never left that level of

faith. Jesus loves me this I know for

the Bible tells me so. OK, great.

But now you're in the middle of a divorce.

How do you know that Jesus is love for you still matters in

these moments? Well, Jesus loves me.

This I know, for the Bible tells me it doesn't quite cut it when

you are going through like the deep valleys and the darkest

nights of the soul. So we need to have a faith that

grows with us. Absolutely.

Um, but at some point I think we as adults leave the dependence

part behind. Like, well, you know, I gotta, I

gotta work for things on my own. I got to earn what I have and I

need to prove that I am of worth and I need to continue to show U

and somebody eventually will recognize that I am of value.

And at some point we, we, we start seeing dependence as this

horrible negative thing. Now, ought we work hard?

Yes, absolutely. Ought we contribute to community

and life together? Yes, for sure.

Like none of those things are bad.

But I think very often we lose sight of the fact that when it

comes to our relationship with God, we are dependent and

maintain that dependence all the way through life.

And so I think what she is really is saying is A1, like

first plate, like, like sort of first, the place to start is by

recognizing our dependence and from recognizing.

Now, are there also good qualities?

Like, should life be more curious than cynical?

Yes, sure. Absolutely.

Yeah. And kids are more curious and

adults are more cynical generally, right?

Should we be filled with wonder? Like I would love to be filled

with wonder. Like my kids when they see

something for the very first time.

Yeah, absolutely. I see that.

And I go, I want something like that.

Like, God help me to have this newfound, like second almost not

I would say second naivete because that's what philosophers

use. But like this second sort of

season of wonder where you recapture wonder and things

that, you know, children see. Yeah, for sure.

Are those good? Yes.

Only when they are think are have their starting point with

dependents. I want, I wonder if like an

adult version of some of that can be, you know, for, for me,

something I've started to really work through is like, rather

than wonder because that's harder to muster up myself.

It's just like mystery, like like there's a lot of there's a

lot of things I'm never going to solve in this life.

And, and that I'm never like, I think that my like, you know,

postmodern imperial evidence, you know, based mind wants to

know the answer to all these things.

And just like trying to centre myself on the fact that like,

hey, like somethings are just be a mystery.

And that's actually like wonder in that of like, I'm not gonna

figure this out. Yeah, one day I'm gonna ask

Jesus about it. And and like there's actually

something like. Profound and and also dependent

about that, right? So there is like that feels like

a a maybe a a grown up equivalent in some ways.

I don't. Know yeah for me it's curiosity

like that's the language that that really helps because, you

know, it pushes against the the you know, the person who would

say, well, you're just telling me to accept everything blindly.

No ask a million questions. Yeah.

Like what are kids great at driving you nuts by asking why

10,000 times in 5 minutes? Like there is something good

about like the this desire for knowledge and to figure out how

the world works. And so for me it's this in the

same way I think it the languages.

How do you remain curious about life in God and your own self.

And that's the thing that guards against bitterness and

resentment and cynicism is staying as curious as possible

instead of closing off. Yeah.

So, you know, childlike faith begins with dependence and then

can include so many of these things.

But I think what I would warn people about doing is just

simply creating a new list of ways in which you are working to

solve the problem for yourself, because that's not what Jesus is

saying. And so childlike faith, it can

be filled with wonder. And as you've said, I think

mystery is a good way to, to to put it right.

And being OK when tensions don't resolve and being alright when

you don't know the answers to all of the things.

And like I said, for me, it's it's about curiosity and this

constant wonder about what you know, what could be and what God

is doing and what is, you know, my place in all of it.

And constantly trying to pray into figuring those things out.

Hmm O. O hopefully this gives us lots

of things to, to chew on, whether you're talking with

family or friends from the church or whatever that looks

like for you just to be thinking about.

I think particularly this last little bit, you know, OK, what

does it look like for me to have a childlike faith?

And then also asking that other question of like, Hey, Jesus,

like what's what's the one thing that I like?

What's, what's the one thing that I need to and that's that's

a hard thing to do. That's a like, you might need to

carve like a an hour or two just to like sit with God in that.

And it can be uncomfortable. But we hope that you will take

some time to do just that. And also, we hope that you'll

come back next week as we continue on in Luke.

And I'm sure next week will be very, very different based on

the upcoming passage. But yeah, we hope that this has

been helpful for you in some ways and we hope that you will

join us next time. Have a great week.