Live It Out Podcast- Christmas Presence: Week 1

Welcome back to Live It Out a podcast.

We are in a new series called Christmas

Presents,

and this is week one. Hey, Tim. How

are you? I'm good, Dave. How are you

doing? I'm good. And this week, we have

somebody with us, and I wanna give you

guys a clue of who we have. Here's

the clue. Oh, brah. It's just like, dude,

you got the best barrels ever, dude. Just

like you pull in, and you just get

spit right out of them. You just drop

in and just smack the lip. Go back.

Drop the excess soap.

Alright. And that should be enough. That should

be enough. Dave Nichols. Dave Nichols. Yeah. What

Nichols. All the way from

Welcome. He's Cinco.

Yeah. Formerly of Southern California. Formerly. Yeah. That's

good. You're surfing. Days. Or a time ago.

Yeah. At this point. Did you were you

you weren't a surfer, were you?

Not really. Okay. He's a baseball player. Yeah.

Body surfed. Okay. Probably more than anything. Yeah.

Catch the layup. Some people call it boogie

boarding. Yeah. But if you're in the biz,

you call it body boarding.

Bodyboarding? Yeah. You don't wanna call it boogie

boarding. People from The Netherlands call it boogie

boarding. Yeah. Yeah. Like little kids. When they're

on vacation. But when you get into it

Yeah. It's body boarding. Dude, I'm smarter today

because of that. You're welcome. Find out like

you really are. You really are from Tennessee

now because the story you told this weekend,

you have a

a UT dog.

So that makes you officially a a Tennessean.

You know what? And I just I just

read this morning, so I have a blue

tic hound. And I just read Smokey eleven,

the current one. He was nervous. Yeah. He

couldn't handle it. Really? Yeah. So I'm like,

does that mean there's a spot open? You've

got a chance. I looked at Roscoe, and

I said, Roscoe,

it's your shot, buddy.

Yeah. It was his brother was the previous

version,

and then they had him, and he just

couldn't adapt. Yeah. Really? Yeah. They said his

temperament is too reserved,

and so running out in front of a

100,000 people probably is a different was too

loud. Uh-huh. He couldn't handle it. Yep. That's

crazy.

Alright. Hey. So we're getting in. We just

wanna embrace the idea that this is

it sounds our podcast is, like lunch with

with the fellas, but not really. Really, the

the goal of the podcast is, hey, what's

it look like for us to put this

stuff into motion? And so this weekend,

hey, we're starting this weekend, we kicked off.

It's the march to Christmas. And so I

wanna start with just a a very personal

question.

Are you a Christmas person? Are you a

Christmas guy?

Dave?

Are are you a Christmas guy? I am.

Alright. Yeah. So so what does that mean

for you?

For me, it's like I've always loved it.

And I think

too often, especially when I was little, I

had too high of expectations.

Mhmm. You know? Mhmm. Like, oh, man. I'm

gonna

I'm gonna get all this stuff. And it's

like, yeah.

I got some and it was cool. But

one year,

we got a computer.

Yeah. A March.

Uh-huh. And Mhmm. I was so disappointed. Oh.

Because I was, like, 10. Mhmm. Uh-huh. And

I wanted, like, fun things. I didn't wanna

sit and play Oregon Trail. Yeah. It was

like, then it was like,

Oregon Trail. Word processor.

Yeah. I had the I learned to type

on Mavis Beacon Teaches Typing. Nice. Do you

remember that? Maybe not. I No. I learned

You probably learned how to type I learned

on a typewriter.

Yeah. I've read about those. I tell you

what, it was

yeah. Yeah. We're about I'm ten years older

than you are. But,

yeah, to type in class at the time,

it was like, this is so silly. Why?

Why? We're never gonna need this. I'm telling

you, man. The best

skill I ever learned was actually tight. Sometimes

I'm amazed myself.

I'm like,

this is kind of amazing. My fingers just

know where to go on this team. Know

what to do. Yeah. It's a s d

f g h a k l, semicolon. That

was a big thing to learn. Yeah.

So, Tim, how about you? Are you a

Christmas person? Listen, Christmas guys fall a spectrum.

Yeah. They they are. But but you're from

a long line of preacher people. You should

really be a Christmas person. That should make

me a new stereotype. That should make me

a Christmas person.

Or it could go or it could go

the complete opposite. Yeah. We don't know. Facts.

Yeah.

I maybe I'm less of one than I

was when I was a kid. I feel

like I was so I when I was

a kid, I was so into Christmas traditions,

and everything needed to be the same every

year.

And then by the time, you know, I

was the youngest, my brothers moved away, and

then I did. And so it kinda I

was like, well, the traditions are all dead.

But we've built new ones as a family.

And so I would say I'm a Christmas

guy. I'll I mean

but I am not it's because I'm a

Christmas guy that I don't decorate early. I

don't start listening to Christmas music early because

you gotta savor the flavor. You gotta

have it

set aside

for

the Christmas season.

When does that begin?

For me,

I mean, it's acceptable anytime after Thanksgiving. Alright.

Fair enough. But I really like to get

to December 1. Fair enough. Yeah. Then we're

in. Yeah. We're we're we're we're marching towards

it. Yeah.

So,

yeah. Me, not not so much. I probably

shared that on here before. I'm I'm I'm

not a Christmas guy,

and I feel like my my kids maybe

they get gypped a little bit because of

it. I feel like my family gets gypped

a little bit because of it. Now now

I'm not saying that, like, I'm not like,

they don't get me wrong. They've never, like,

not had They've never lacked. They've never lacked.

There's no doubt about that. But, however,

I'm just yeah. I and I probably need

counseling because of it for there's probably something

deep seated there. Or your kids do. Exactly

too. Or both. I've already I've said this

probably too. Like, they both do six sessions

for my parenting faux pas.

But in the midst of all that, I

I don't know. You know? Maybe it's because

I got I I I think it was

last year I told the story about getting

peanuts one year, and maybe it's because I

got peanuts. I kinda like, let me scarred.

Maybe Christmas wasn't so fun anymore. Yeah. No.

But maybe Like Charlie Brown on Halloween. I

gotta rock. It's not because my parents didn't

do a great job. Yeah. My parents did

a great job. I mean, there was, like

yeah. Anyway,

they they and it's not like they they

didn't go over the top with it, but

they didn't. Yeah. I mean, I I don't

care any any wounds for my parents specifically,

so I wonder what that's all about. You

just said you needed counseling. So there's some

wound in there somewhere. No. That's what I'm

saying, but it's not for my parents. It

doesn't know where it's from. Yeah. Yeah. Okay.

Fair enough. I don't know. All I have

to say, hey, we're talking this year, this

this series is about the true gift, which

is God with us. That's that's the gift

of Christmas.

And, that's that's our theme. And we're gonna

be going through some Old Testament text, some

new testament text. And this past weekend,

Dave, you had us in Exodus, and we're

talking about how Jesus' presence is the ultimate

gift that guides us and gives us rest.

So,

as you think about God's presence, at what

point in your life did you did you

start to pivot and go, woah, this isn't

really about the rules.

This is about me living from a place

of being present with Jesus himself.

Or have you? I know when. I think

I've talked about it before. I read a

book when I was just out of college,

and that's

when I went for it wasn't that

I thought it was only about following rules,

but I thought the rules were kind of

what mattered. I don't like like,

I didn't think I could earn God's love

by following the rules, but I didn't know

how else I could interact with God than

follow rules.

Like what other

relationship can we have? You make rules.

I try to follow them and fail at

it. That's the nature of our relationship. That's

that was the that was the, I think,

the total for me,

up to that point. And so then,

yeah, it was a big moment to go,

wait a second. Relationship means relationship,

and God is here, and he's not going

anywhere.

So you can actually

have a relationship because he's present, you know.

So that was a, I mean, that was,

in some ways, the turning point in my

relationship with Jesus.

I think that is probably pretty common in

the story of following Jesus. Yeah. Where it's

like, how do I relate to this God

that I can't see?

So rules are right there. And so we

don't

we don't drink. We don't smoke. We don't

go with girls who do, you know, kinda

thing. And so then I either do it

or don't.

And I know this is not a great

analogy, but I think parenting actually changed some

of my perspective.

And,

even when my kids disobey my rules, the

relationship doesn't stop. Yeah. That's a good question.

Where yeah. Yeah. But I mean, it's it's

it was one of those things where it's

like,

yeah.

Just because they didn't my kids didn't do

what I wanted them to do or whatever,

I'm

I don't stop loving them. I don't stop

relationship. And I think that was when,

you know, in that journey, that was another

kinda turning point of going, oh,

yeah, God. Just because I didn't obey a

rule or I messed up or I

it doesn't break relationship. Uh-huh. Yeah. So

Yeah.

I I think for me, like,

I think you said, David, I think it's

it's common for a lot of experiences. And

for me, it was there was this movement,

and I hear people talking about a personal

relationship with Jesus. And then I'm like, okay,

Jesus is a real person. And so what's

that look like for me to interact with

him?

But if I think about, like like, some

specific moments and I don't have

I do not have a great memory around

a lot of things. In fact, my wife

will often be like, hey, you remember this

or hey, you remember that? I'm like, I

no, I don't. Or Todd Michelson, we were

on staff before the church before Two Rivers.

Mhmm. You know, so it's, like, fifteen, sixteen

years ago. And he's like, hey. Do you

remember when you and at that point, he

could make up anything because I remember nothing.

I have no idea what he's talking about.

I'm like, I don't remember that at all.

How do you? But but there's a couple

moments where I remember. I was actually already

I was pastoring a church in Texas,

and there's a couple things in that that

stand out. There's a lot of horrifying moments

in that and,

because god is gracious, I still get to

do this for a living, and and I

just I messed up a lot.

All that to say,

there was a couple times there's a couple

times that stand out where it was things

that seemed people would think were totally insignificant.

But in that moment, God reminded me just

how how really was. And I think I've

told one of them before about being underneath

the sink in the in the parsonage,

of this church and, you know, trying to

fix the sink and, not having to call

the the church maintenance guy to do it

and and being like, god, you could you

could back that nut right off of that

thing if you wanted to because the tool

didn't fit up there right. It was really

tight space,

and I couldn't get it. I couldn't get

it. I couldn't get it. And I was

so just frustrated and

and, frustrated probably to the point of almost

tears. Like, just you've got to be kidding

me. How can I not figure this out?

And I and I literally paused and I

was like, I could even pray about this.

It seems like such a stupid thing to

pray about in in my mind and logically.

And it was like, okay. God, you could

literally back that thing off if you wanted

to.

And,

I went back and the thing was loose.

And it was crazy. And then there was

another time I had lost my wallet and

I was praying.

And,

I don't know. I just felt like I

was supposed to go in the yard. And

I literally walk into my yard. Why was

my wallet in my I still don't know

to this day why the wallet was in

the yard. But I literally walk into the

yard and I looked down and there it

is. And I pick it up. And I

was like, okay.

So surely, if you care about these little

things and letting you know you're real, that

there's other things along the way. And so

I I think that's one of the reasons

why I'm I'm really glad to be a

part of a church like Two Rivers. It's

because it's not just the Bible says Jesus

is real. We also go towards

the experience that Jesus is real. And I

think this Christmas, really what we're encouraging

families to do and through the Live It

Out guide is to be present with one

another

and to experiment with things and prove that

that God is real. So, Tim, talk a

little bit about our structure this week in

that

it's always intended that it should be something

that you could

adapt and use in conversation with other followers

of Christ or

even

with, your kids. Yeah. But we've tried to

make this Christmas

especially that way. Yeah. So yeah. So,

we do always try and have it. You

know, certainly that a high schooler could pick

up Live It Out and and work through

it. And,

and then you could have you could talk

about some of those things as a family.

And,

in this series, we're just trying to be

really deliberate about saying, okay. Middle schoolers, high

schoolers, we wanna write questions that are con

you know, concrete enough and

clear enough, I guess, that, a a middle

schooler could could pick this up and do

and do it. And so we hope that

they will. And maybe for some, it'll start

a new habit. And, so I'm interested in

what in how that works for people. So

they might notice a change in the questions

during this series that they might feel a

little more, you know, just a little more

concrete.

But that might be good for everybody, not

just for the middle schoolers and high schoolers

in our church. And then,

and and and, again, just to be clear,

the reason for that is not so that

a family would sit down and go, let's

do Live It Out together. Yeah. Let's do

devotions. Right. Yeah. It's not written as a

family devotional,

but it's a

it's a discipleship guide for individuals with the

idea that the reason

a whole family would do it or a

whole church does it is so that we're

all

we're all kinda in the same swimming in

the same water

in our time,

with

in the word with God. And so then

we can have some conversations about that. So

that's my hope is that families would,

and friends and roommates would go, hey. You

know, I I read this. I was thinking

about this because of Live It Out, and

to even be able to do that with

your kids. And then over the next not

it's not in this week, but in the

next three weeks, the three weeks leading up

to Christmas,

we'll have some,

some tangible little act each week, one kind

of activity that a family or group of

friends can do to kinda be present in

their community,

as we move towards Christmas. That's awesome. Alright.

So this weekend, we were in Exodus.

We were looking at

the significance of God's presence going with the

children of Israel, in particular.

And,

we talked about this idea that, God has

always wanted to dwell with his people. That's

kind of the point of

the story in general. And so,

as as we get started, actually, it only

it only took us fifteen minutes in this

podcast to actually talk about the text.

So in that,

David, is there anything you're like, hey, these

are some of the things that this weekend,

I didn't really get a chance to to

go as far. I mean, there's only so

far you can go in thirty five minutes

with a with a text that that is

pretty significant and Yeah. In size, anyway. Yeah.

Significant in size. How do you yeah. Is

there anything that you're like, okay. Here here

are a couple things, man. I didn't get

to to go as far as I wanted

to, or I I didn't even really maybe

get to touch.

Yeah. I mean, there's there's a lot in

this passage, especially when you look at the

context of the passage and you think about

the book of Exodus as a whole.

So there's a lot that you can't,

that built up

to get to the point of where we're

at. Yeah. You know what I mean? Right.

And so, we can't go into all of

that, but,

I mean, you can look at the transformation

of Moses through,

the book of Exodus,

and which is pretty incredible, and we'll hit

on that just a little bit. But to

go from Exodus three,

where God is promising his presence over and

over and over again, and Moses goes,

not good enough.

And God's like, well, alright, I'll send Aaron.

And he's like, okay, I'll go.

To a point where we are in Exodus

33 where

Moses refuses to go if God doesn't go.

So his presence

God didn't change.

It was Moses' heart that changed as he

spent time with him. But and even even

being reminded as just looking at

Christmas season and looking at the scripture as

a whole.

I mean, just a reminder that

the overarching story of the Bible seems to

be God dwelling with his people.

Like, that's his pursuit. That's what he does.

He he dwells with them in Eden.

That relationship's broken.

And after that, it is the reuniting

of heaven and earth. It's a reuniting

of an Eden place where God dwells with

his people. And you just see it

run through the story line of scripture from

a tabernacle

that we see starting to dwell in

in Exodus where God is going on moving

in. And,

then they get to the promised land and

gets more of a permanent home that Solomon

builds for them.

Then we have Jesus, Emmanuel,

God physically dwelling with his people.

Then we get to the book of John

and Jesus starts telling his disciples, like, hey,

it's better that I leave. Because if I

leave, I'm gonna send my helper. My Holy

Spirit's gonna be with you. So

he still remains with us and Jesus promises,

I'm I'm coming back and

I'm gonna be with you. And so

this presence is

in some ways, you could you could make

a good argument that that's the story of

the Bible.

Mhmm. Yeah. Yeah. And I hope that

you know, like, even as we were writing

Live It Out for this week, it was

like, well, how much of Exodus do we

read? Because you could go it's actually I

mean, hopefully people will I'm hoping that people

either remember some from when we were in

Exodus, whenever that was, Yeah. Or that just

there

you know, like, for me, it was like,

oh, I gotta go back and read a

little bit further back in in this leading

up to this point,

because it really is you're right. It's this

whole

Jesus

God isn't just getting the the Israelites out

of Egypt just so they

don't have to be slaves anymore. Mhmm. He

wants them to live in his presence. And

Yeah. That's Yeah. What he's been working at.

And it's amazing, like right before the Exodus

33 passage,

God makes a covenant with them.

And the people are crying out, they're like,

we're all in. He's like, I'm moving in.

And he's like, you're gonna make

a dwell I you're gonna make a dwelling,

a tent that's that's mobile, and I'm gonna

give you the instructions for this. I'm gonna

be your god, and you're gonna be my

people. And they're it's almost like they cheer.

They're like, Yeah! Let's do it! We're in!

Yeah, they do. That's what they're doing. And

then

Moses goes up the mountain,

and he's on top of the mountain, and

it talks about that smoke and fire on

the top of the mountain.

So, the people can see this,

and then they're like, Well, Moses is probably

dead,

so let's build a calf.

So, I mean, they went from

in a very I mean, how long were

they at Sinai? A year, I think, overall.

So, we don't know how long a gap

they made this covenant to. Yeah. Like,

well, Moses is probably dead,

but not that long, and God's presence is

still pretty visible.

And they're like, hey, let's build a calf

because he's gone. It reminds me. I mean,

like, we're how much I am, we are

like the Israelites. You know, just a few

weeks ago at Quiet Waters when we were

talking about, that theme kinda came up of

saying, oh, I I, you know, I wanna

I

wanna go the way of Jesus, but I

also wanna keep one foot Yeah. On my

own path. Kind of this split kingdom thing.

Yeah. One foot in each camp. And

that's like, Yeah. It's just how easy it

is to be like Israel and go,

yes. God's way is the best. I'm in.

I wanna go his way. I wanna follow

him. Well, but in this particular situation, I

need to just Yeah. I need to cover

things with a little more But a calf

is pretty cool too. Right. Just to make

sure my bases are covered. Well, and it's

sometimes easy to look at something like that

and go, man, those Israelites are so dumb.

I would never

like, if I was in that situation, I

would just

and it's like,

no. I mean, we have the Holy Spirit

in us, which is actually better than God

on top of a mountain. Yeah.

And, how often do we do that? Like,

I'm in. Yeah. I'm in. Oh, but that's

pretty shiny and cool, and I'm gonna go

after that too. Is that part of that

idea you think of

of rest? Is that like, okay,

if I

will just believe that God is present like

he says he is, then I don't have

to

Yeah. You know, I mean, I think there

was some panic in

making that golden calf, you know? Like, oh,

he's he's not here. Moses isn't here. We're

in trouble. We gotta figure something out. We

gotta have something.

Yeah. But

Yeah.

I think

yeah. In particular, I mean, the golden calf

one is is interesting because

it's,

here's your god. Like like, we know we're

following a god, and all the gods have

a a physical representation.

All the gods that the children of Israel

had known up to that point in their

world,

would have been

a physical representation. I mean, they just came

from Egypt that had

a boatload of them. Yeah. Yeah. And so,

I think for the big thing, I think

for the majority of us, we were raised

to believe

that there's

one God, which is true. That's a fact.

But then the idea that there would be

other the other gods are all fake and

false. True. Factual.

But

but probably

not factual in the way we're communicating. We

really don't understand

that that the children of Israel were surrounded

by a group of people who

they never thought that the representation of the

god was the god.

Like, that I grossly misunderstood that. Right? Like

It's an inhabitation

place. Yeah. Like, I make the thing, and

then it's a it's a representation of the

thing in my life, and it becomes inhabited.

But the god isn't it, and it doesn't

live there. And to understand that they knew

that those gods were spiritual beings,

and they just gave them different different

acknowledgment than we we do. And and all

of a sudden when you grasp that, you're

like, the golden calf isn't as crazy as

it seems

because

here's the physical representation of your god. Of

course, you would do that. Here it is.

And it's interesting. I threw it in the

fire. Out came this calf.

And and to realize that we've done something

now that has has broken the relational

agreement.

And the other thing is is we think,

like,

this well, now they need the sacrificial system,

and they just keep messing it up. And

so how do we see that at the

middle of God's story, it's all been about

them, what you said this weekend, Dave,

seeking

God's presence. And then at the very middle

of it, you said that the Mount Sinai

is a year, and that's called the book

of Leviticus. Mhmm. It's that year

where at the center of that book is

the day of atonement,

which is all about maintaining

God's presence at the center of God's community.

Mhmm. And when you get that, like, we

were told Leviticus is irrelevant. And this year,

we, you know, we went through that

last a year ago, over a year ago,

that it's always been about maintaining God's presence

in the middle of his people.

And that hasn't changed. And when you get

to

Galatians,

Paul actually ties it in there, and we

studied that too.

Like, at the end of the day, Christ

has come.

It says in chapter three, Christ redeemed us

from the curse of the law by becoming

a curse for us. For it is written,

cursed is everyone who is hanged on a

tree,

so that in Christ Jesus the blessing of

Abraham

might come to the nations. Mhmm. And I

would encourage you, every time you see the

word Gentiles in your New Testament, say nations.

So that we might receive

the promised spirit

through faith.

That it's always been about

that we are the holy dwelling of God.

And Christmas is an incredible

reminder as we celebrate the first coming of

Christ and the second coming of Christ,

that is a great reminder that it's always

been about us living aware of the presence

of God. So

it it doesn't matter if we're in an

Old Testament story or in a New Testament

story.

Like, what what is it that we're learning

about being people who are living in in

the presence of God?

So this week, as as we're working our

way through Live It Out, we're we're reminding

people,

what does that look like? What helps you

remember what that Jesus is with you at

home, at school, at work, with friends?

And what are some of the things that

that have worked for you? What are some

of the things in the past that you

would say, hey, here are some things that

have worked this weekend. It's like, okay, what's

a tangible reminder? And you gave one. But

what are some things that you would say,

here are some practices in my life that

have helped me to live with great intentionality,

aware

that god is present with me. And then

and then we'll come back and we'll ask,

okay, and what happens when I lose that

awareness?

Do live it out every day. Yeah. There

you go. That's what I know. That's almost

a good start. Podcast calling. Today. Okay. What

is that one? But what are some okay.

There's one, but that gets us started. Starting

the day with something as good. It is

hard. It you know, it's that anybody's read

that,

brother Lawrence practicing the presence of God. It

is sort of that, like, I I do

struggle with there are times when it I

just seem to be better at being aware.

God is here. We're doing this together. And

by doing this, I mean just everything in

life.

And other times where it gets easier for

me to,

skip through whole chunks of my day without,

yeah, without without that awareness.

And

so I I I feel like maybe I

I mentioned the same things frequently, but I

can't remember what's on the podcast and what's

you know, we talk about this, Dave, or

what's on in a hallway conversation.

But for me, something that has always been

really, really helpful is

my dorky, old

Bible memory app. People are like, what's their

Bible memory app? It's it's a tear oh,

I don't know. It's not a terrible app,

but it's it is not cutting edge. It

does not look good. It's from the it's

old, you know, as much as an iPhone

app can be old.

On your phone, they could be pretty old,

though, dude.

It's like

a

The prehistoric version of iPhone three. I thought

somebody said what? Yesterday. Is that an iPhone

five? Somebody in the office said that. Come

on.

No. What is it actually? Did you actually

answer that question? This is an iPhone 13

Mini. It's just small. Oh. But 13 is

only like four

generations back. They're on 17 homes. Yep.

13 is almost iPhone pre historic. When did

they stop updating them?

I don't know. I don't know.

Yeah. Yeah.

But don't worry. That app will still work.

Yeah.

No wonder it looks like trash.

Right. Yeah. That's true. It is 20 10

years old or whatever, 15 years old. But

it's

that is a thing that helps me.

I'm like, it feels like cheating to go,

well, I'm just memorizing a Bible verse, so,

of course, that's gonna make you think of

God. I don't know. I that's what I

need. Yeah. Is The simplicity of it. Yeah.

Yeah. Like, I just need something to force

me.

Yeah. It's not even like a

I'm sorry to say, it's not even like

a attitude of my heart. Like, I just

wanna be aware of god's presence. It's like,

oh, I wanna

see if I can

get this one right.

And then that helps that that gets me

to, oh, I wanna be aware of God's

presence. You know? Yeah. I wish I didn't

need the crutch, but I do. Yeah. Yeah.

I think a lot of times it's like,

some things begin as a box check.

Yeah. You know what I mean? Of, like,

I memorize this first or I did my

devotional. I did live it out, and you'd

box check it.

But I think God is gracious enough that

he takes the box checks and actually grows

desire within us. And that's not to say

that I'm with you, Tim. It's not all

the time that I'm just going. I'm not

Brother Lawrence going. I'm practicing the presence of

Jesus as I wash dishes and stuff like

that.

But, I think

I'm with you. I

need tangible things because, yeah, I'll get up

and spend time in the Word

and then it's almost like I just go

about my day and,

you know,

just do what I wanna do in some

ways. And,

so I need tangible reminders of going, oh,

yeah.

I'm in this. We're in this together. And,

yeah. I wish I was further along. Don't.

Maybe I am. But Me too. Yeah. Me

too. I think for me too, things like,

it's okay for things to come in ebb

and flow

and for me to be aware

of God's presence right now.

I I am a music person, although I'm

not exactly,

You're a bass player. I'm a yeah. Musician.

In the worship band. I am so far

from a musician, but I love music. Music.

I do love music. And I've learned the

rudimentary skills of playing worship bass, which is

far from playing the bass.

Anyway, all that to say,

for right now, it's been a little bit,

and I've shared it before, that for it's

been worship music for me because because the

truth and people would say, well, of course,

it is. You're a pastor. Of course, that's

you know. And and the answer is no.

It's not. I've gone through seasons in my

life where there's been times where it has

been and it hasn't been. And the the

brutal truth is I love country music. That's

what I love. You know? And

God's music.

Yeah. So yeah. Is that is that yeah.

Yeah. Exactly. Just kidding. Yeah. Just a prank.

Yeah. No. Really. I I and and it's

like,

I hope that doesn't make me a bad

person. Right? I'd that's what I if I'm

gonna just choose to listen to

something. And so listening to worship music as

a discipline,

not just as background,

has been really has been really helpful for

me during this season of my life to

try and remember,

to live in the presence of of God.

And it does matter

because then that brings the second question is,

what what's the tendency in your life and

I know this is gonna be cliche, but

if you could drive it to concrete,

what's the tendency what's the thing that you

would notice in your life

when you start to become

unaware? Like, what's your go to, like, oh,

okay. I'm unaware.

Maybe this isn't I don't know it. Maybe

this isn't concrete enough. But when you asked

that, I pulled up,

my you know, just for people listening, we

a

and staff, we have a day that we

kind of use to

look back and look forward and make sure

we're aligned with,

the work that we're doing. And and one

of the things we do on that day

is fill out a little

I mean, we call it a report. Yeah.

It's a report. Yeah. But the first question

on there is Update. Yeah. Maybe that's a

good word. Yeah. Yeah.

But the first question on there is, what

is God currently teaching you? And,

I was I felt like I've been experiencing

just what you're describing, like, just not being

aware. So this is maybe not as concrete

as you're asking Dave, but this is what

I wrote. I said, trying to remember to

listen for the Spirit's promptings

moment to moment.

It's easy for me to go into my

own little,

in quotes, me world internally and pay no

attention to how God might wanna guide me.

And that's what I notice is, like, I

just

I just

a whole day or big chunks of the

day can go by, and I'm just in

in

internally in my brain. I'm just in

in it's like it's just me there, you

know? Yeah.

I don't know how else to describe it

other than that. But I I notice when

that happens that, like, I just haven't wondered,

what does God want me to do? Where

is he Yeah. What has he been up

to? Yeah. What does he want in this

moment for me? I'm just like, I've just

been doing my thing all day or for

days or for weeks. Yeah. That's not good.

I think,

the Bible Project guys talk about,

like, the presence of God brings order, and,

like, when there's a removal of God's presence,

it brings chaos. And and they have a

whole

series, the chaos dragon and all this stuff,

and which is really good.

But I think there is, like, a like,

a personal reality that I experience

when

when I when I practice and live intentionally

in the very presence of God. Like, in

in Exodus 33,

God's like, Moses intercedes on behalf of the

people of Israel,

and God,

like, kinda relents and he goes, Moses, I'll

go with you, and it's singular. He goes,

I'll go with you and I'll give you

rest. And Moses once again intercedes and goes,

no. It's an us saying God. And he's

like, alright. I'll go.

But that that rest, like, when I practice

and live intentionally in those spaces,

there's less chaos in my mind and my

heart. Mhmm. But when I think that I've

got it figured out, or or maybe even

worse, not even that I have it figured

out, but I'm the one that has to

figure it out,

it's easy for me to have that my

mind just starts to kinda swirl, and my

heart becomes anxious. And, like, there's just things.

And so that

that rest that God talks about, he's like,

yeah, I'm gonna give you rest.

That's what I want, but I don't get

it. And so, I mean, that can even

play itself out, and I'm not sleeping. I'm

waking up at two or three in the

morning or I'm whatever because my mind just

won't shut down.

And it's in those moments that I find

myself going,

I've been trying to do

I've been trying to do this on my

own. I've been trying to do it like

I'm smart enough to figure it out. I'm

I'm capable enough or whatever.

When it's like I can't find my wallet

and maybe maybe I should just pause and

pray and then I go into my yard

and find it. You know what I mean?

Yeah. So

No. I I can relate to all of

that for sure. That's that's a 100%.

I think for me, it's I definitely can

notice the indicators

where

I get

irritated and angry

when I'm not aware. I it's just easy

for me just to to get irritated and

angry, and and I'm like, woah, where where

is that? I thought I thought I was

addressing that. And it's like, oh, yeah. Just

forget that Jesus is in

is at work in you. Yeah. Here we

go. Yeah. You know?

Yeah. So I I would say probably my

family probably

can probably see that.

I don't know that we've ever actually had,

you know, be able to put words to

that. Mhmm. You know, it's it's like, okay,

this isn't just

as the anxiety level is is rising.

It's not just, oh, you need to try

harder. It's like, oh, you need to be

more aware. And I think that's gonna be

yeah. As we go through this Christmas, that's

gonna be try and be my,

spiritual discipline.

Is okay. It's one thing to talk about,

celebrating Jesus' presence, but what's it look like

for me just to be aware

of that? And

as I am, I think the people around

me maybe can

see that a little bit.

So,

as we get ready to head into this

week and the busyness of Christmas

is ramping up,

even as,

you know, we're still a couple weeks out,

but

it ramps up and

parties are happening and,

all the the activities between family and friends

and work and everything starts going. What are

some things that you would say, hey, as

you take a look at this week, make

sure you don't miss

make sure you don't miss this. Once again,

it's not like this is what I was

saying. It's not like just,

hey. Make sure that this Christmas,

you, you know,

keep keep, you know, Jesus is the reason

for the season. Yeah. Duh. You know, like,

I think there's a piece of it. It's

like, yeah, of course. Yeah. But but how

do we make sure that we're practicing

the presence of of Christ in us

in the midst of all that's coming on?

How do we redeem the time, so to

speak? And so, is there anything you would

say, hey, this week, I want to make

sure that that this is a thing we're

focusing on, or this is a thing that

we're we're really paying attention to?

I think for me, as I think about

that question in particular, it's it's,

to go back, Tim, to what you were

talking a little bit earlier, that quiet waters

of one foot in one kingdom and one

foot in God's kingdom, that we like to

straddle it. And,

the kingdom of the world is gonna go

get busier,

get, I mean,

faster,

more,

all the things. Right? Mhmm. And it's like,

no. If I can if I can intentionally

and it and that for me, it's gonna

take that. It's gonna take intentionally stepping back

from that and I'm going, woah, I'm getting

caught up. Yeah. I'm getting caught like, I

find myself getting busier and busier and busier

and what I needed the right whatever.

And it's like, no. Hold on a sec.

So I think if we can we talk

about, like, finding something tangible this week. Let

let the things of the season

just be tangible. And we've talked about this

in

Christmases past before, but

let the things

be tangible reminders

of Jesus as compared

to the kingdom of the world. And so,

I take my dogs for walks at night.

It's it's fun to see the Christmas lights

as people are starting to put more on

up and but let those be a tangible

reminder to be grateful to Mhmm. To Jesus,

the light of the world, and I know

we're gonna get there in this series. But

what are things that we can actually just

leverage

in this season

to be reminders of the very presence of

Jesus?

Mhmm.

Yeah. Yeah. And I think even, like, you

know,

I think there's a bunch of ways you

can do it. You can stick a Post

it note on your dashboard. I just think

about how I get in my car and

drive every day. Or or but or even,

like,

just decide.

I don't know if people's brains work this

way, but I think mine does something. Just

decide, like, okay. When I listen to when

Christmas music comes on, I'm gonna listen for

that. Just this, you know,

this Christmas season. I'm gonna list if if

this idea of Emmanuel, God with us, is

at the core of what Christmas is about,

then I'm just gonna listen for that in

all the songs. And some of them will

be Jingle Bells or,

you know, it might be a little harder.

But but the ones that are truly Christmas

songs Yeah.

Just to be listening for that because they'll

you know, sometimes in old fashioned

language,

hark the herald angels sing, you know, like,

but listen for, like,

okay. This is

God is here. Mhmm. And what a gift

that is, you know? Like, it's It takes

a mindset though. Yeah. You have to if

you

my mind doesn't naturally do that. It's choosing

Right. To go,

no. I'm gonna do this. Yeah. I'm gonna

listen. It's a discipline. Yeah. To think about

this thing. To be reminded of this thing.

And I think really for me, what I

wanna try and do is be,

you know, in, you know, awe and wonder.

You know? Yeah. Christmas is supposed to be

the, you know, magical season of awe and

wonder. Well, it should be we should feel

some sense of that when I think about,

how massive it is that that

the god of the universe has moved in

to my life, and he's here.

And

I shouldn't just go, yeah. That's cool. You

know? Like, I I wanted to get Francis

Chan that. The god of the universe.

You guys move. You will get this.

Yeah. Sorry. We Francis stand it. Yeah. He's

I love it. He's right

here.

I love Francis. I do too. I think

he's incredible.

Yeah. You too. Yeah. No. I think that's

that's really good advice. I mean, think for

me, it's like which is what sounds so

weird. It's to be able to say, well,

I'm not really like a Christmas guy. And

you're like, well,

how could you not be? You're a follower

of Christ. How could you not be? But

there's pieces of it. It's like, okay. How

do I how do I take the crazy

of Christmas

and redeem it? And so I I think

don't be don't don't wait until

a week before, a day before to say,

how do I redeem the the crazy of

this? To be able to think, okay, not

just how do I,

you know, put the Christ back in Christmas

as I mocked earlier.

But but how do I actually see

the the things that we do,

in order to celebrate Christmas? How do I

make sure that I'm I'm redeeming those in

my mind to ensure that they're reminding me

that Jesus really is with me, that the

spirit of God is leading me. He's transforming

me. So in the midst of, you know,

the the party that's coming up, the the

the celebration

family celebration

that's coming up, how do I redeem those

things to say, ultimately, this is about the

the presence of Christ with me? But then

they flip that and say, well, it's also

about what what's that look like when I'm

present with other people? What's it look like

when when I'm living present in the moment?

And for me, that that's very difficult. Kinda

like what you said earlier, Tim. I can

I can check out and live life in

my head? And,

there's times where that's really helpful,

and there's times where that's not helpful at

all. So as we head into this week,

Boobard, do you have a final word, or

did you already give it? I think I

gave it. He gave it. And so I

think we all left a final word. That's

the final word. See you.