Christmas Stories and Relational Gifts | Life Group Live | Trinity Talks Podcast

I was having a lot of fun trying to put on my Christmas tree hat, but I don't think I made it in time.

Anyway, here we are. I've got the three Js with me. I've got Jesse, Jordan, and Jessica.

We were just saying all they need is Jesus in their midst, which they could be the fantastic four.

But maybe we do have Jesus in our midst anyway. Well done for being the J crew.

Thank you for joining me on this third Sunday of Advent for our Trinity Talks.

We heard in the sermon today about giving more. I was hoping that because you guys are a life group

and you have some people in a life group together, we could go through some of the life group

questions together, our sermon questions, and talk through those. How does that sound?

Yeah, sounds great. I'm excited to hear some of the responses in our conversation.

But we're getting close to Christmas, and I thought it would be a lot of fun if we played

a little game before that. Do you all have your A and B cards in front of you?

We do. Can we play a little Christmas Would You Rather?

We're going to learn a little bit about all three of you, and you might learn a little bit more

about each other as a small group. I've got some questions for you. We'll go through these quickly

before we get into our sermon questions. All you have to do is just in front of you, put up

the A or the B, depending on what your answer would be. The first question is, would you rather A,

hot chocolate or B, eggnog? Oh, that's an easy one.

That's an easy one. It only comes up once a year. Hot chocolate I can get all the time.

That's right. Eggnog. December 25th, it comes off the shelves, doesn't it? Amen.

All right. So we have the next one is, interpret this as you will, but A or B, A, Rudolph or B,

Frosty? A little bit not as easy to choose this one. I could eat a Frosty.

That's right. We don't want to eat a Rudolph. Okay. Question number three, A, skiing or B,

tobogganing? I don't need skill for tobogganing. I can slam into trees all I want.

I love skiing. All right. We're split on that one.

Tough choice. Next one, this might be more appropriate for next week, but are you more

of an A, early Christmas Eve service person or a late Christmas Eve service person?

Early, oh, split again. All right. Depends what the family's pulling towards,

I guess. That's right. It might change every year.

Yeah, that's right. All right. The next question,

I'm sure you've never been asked before, and this could be a three-parter, but I think gold

would always take number one in this. So instead, I'm going to split it into two. Would you prefer

A, frankincense or B, myrrh? You're supposed to laugh. I don't even know.

I'm just trying to figure out which one smells better.

I think either would be great. So those are good answers. All right. Next one,

A, silent night or B, joy to the world? And whichever one you choose now, you will sing.

I think we warmed up from the blank side. All right. Quick one, A, red or B,

green, Christmas colors? That's a tough one. Wow. All right. We got harder questions coming up,

Jesse. All right. Next one, real tree A or fake tree B? Oh, hands down.

A, AAA, triple A. Gotta get the real smell, the falling needles.

You'll never go back. Oh, you heard it here first. OK, nine.

A, matching family pajamas or B, not matching family pajamas? You see it in ads.

Oh, I'll go for it. Yeah, I'm a B on that one.

Jessica has dignity.

I'm with you on that one. We don't know. We're all unique in our house. All right.

All right. Something to eat, A, gingerbread cookies or B, shortbread cookies? What do you reach for

first? A, A and B. OK, you guys are very split. I love the diversity of this group.

She makes gingerbread. I eat that. Exactly. Whatever's in front of you. All right.

And our very last one is this. Are you an A, early Christmas gift getter or B,

a last minute Christmas gift getter? I wish I was early, but I'm way ahead of time.

But if you're a B, then that could actually segue nicely into our sermon series because

there were some gift ideas that Rob was throwing out left, right and center.

So I think that if you are a B there, then you might be able to get one of those.

Please. Well, that was a lot of fun. So, as you know, and I'm not sure if your small group

or your life group does this, but we have sermon questions that we put out every week. Is that

something that your life group does? Work through some of those questions? Yeah, it depends on the

week. Sometimes we if we have like breaks in between what we usually cover, because sometimes

I have different topics covered by different members of small group. They submit it and we

kind of go through a small series around their topic. But in between that, we do go back to the

sermon questions every once in a while to kind of keep up with the church, to keep up with the

church. Yeah. All right. So I've got some of the questions already in front of me. And I wanted

to start just by asking you some of those questions. So to start us off, when you think back to a

memorable gift that you've been given at Christmas, do you want to share something that sort of stands

out to you as something that was memorable to you? And then maybe we can talk about why.

Well, for me, I got a Taylor Swift CD and inside the CD jacket were tickets to see her show.

As a Swifty, that was pretty exciting. That is exciting. Now, who gave that to you?

It was my parents. Yeah. Yeah. You're a Swifty. When was this? A couple of years ago. This was for

1989. So a few years back. Wow. No big deal. That's fun. I think for me, years ago, I remember this

actually as a child, like when I was younger, my mom gave me a Terry's chocolate orange and I really

wanted them just for the purpose of slamming it down on the ground and having it open up. So that

one kind of stuck sticks out to me. Yeah. Yeah. It's a lot of fun. Yeah. For me, I remember it was my

dad. He got it a bit earlier ahead of Christmas. I think he got it right around Black Friday. That's

why. So it's early Christmas gift. I remember him getting the PS4 when it came out, which

me personally thinking I wasn't thinking of getting that to like way later. So my dad getting that

for me, like pretty much the same year it came out, blew my mind. And the best part was like,

I remember distinctly, it was us rushing to the TV to set it up and kind of basking in the

next generation with me and my sister. So I think the big part of the memories that it wasn't just

kind of, it was for me, it was for everybody. And that's being able to kind of like test it out and

play around with it and everything. So yeah. I'll just tell you one of my most memorable gifts was

a couple of years ago. My husband Elliot had been down in the basement and all I could smell was

like paint stain, like that really powerful stain. And he thought he was being very secretive. But

anyway, he would just go down there and the whole house stunk like paint. But he had built me a

board to do jigsaw puzzles on that had its own drawers to sort. And I mean, it took him a long

time and he thought he was being sneaky, but I could smell it. And it was also in front of my

washing machine. So I saw it. But I absolutely love it. And he spent a lot of time on it. So that

was probably my most memorable gift. So when we think about the passage that we had today at

church, it was actually the beginning of the gospel of John. And he brings us to the beginning of

existence, which is quite an interesting way to start a gospel. And can we reflect a little bit

as a group on in the beginning was the word. So when we think about the beginning of existence,

we hear in the beginning was the word. What implications do you guys think that this has

regarding Jesus's eternal existence? Good question. We're starting to think that we go from cookies to

can we are red or green eternal existence? Wow. So just or even like, what are our thoughts on that?

When thinking in the beginning was the word, I think is comforting, comforting at some level,

because we see God as a living word. He's effectively written existence by speaking into

it. And so especially we go into the Christmas season, we see the birth of Jesus, right? We're

seeing it not just like, I mean, for us is kind of beginning of the Christian story. But the story

from the perspective of God has been from there from the very beginning that we see in Genesis.

And it's just him kind of like that. That's the biggest chapter that I think we're currently

the biggest chapter that I think we're currently living through right now. And that's why I think

it's kind of the when you kind of think of it within the context of hearing him being the living

word, it's such a big significance during Christmas. Yeah. Yeah, I would agree. Just it's

a comforting thought, especially just what there's there's always like crazy things happening in the

world. But just knowing that like, Jesus is always there and he's always with you. It's comforting.

Yeah. Even like, like building on what Jessica just said, like, regardless of what's happening,

just like his comforting words are words are timeless across all circumstances and world

events. And it's it's almost like it's a grounding unit for a lot of us, especially as believers. So

yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Thanks, guys. Thanks, guys. And again, another symbolic thing that John uses,

some other words that he uses are life and light in this in this passage. And so what symbolic

meanings sort of come to mind when we hear these words, life and light about Jesus in particular?

I guess, like, you know, in our world, right, we're we're surrounded by so much darkness in

the metaphorical sense, like war and suffering and poverty. And and the the illustration of light

just represents this like washing away of this darkness. Right. And that's I guess that's

symbolically what what Jesus is. Right. Like he is the washing away of darkness and sin.

I love that washing away. And actually, in the Gospel of John, he uses a lot of water imagery,

too. So I hear I love seeing that come into play. Yeah. Yeah. It makes me think of the resurrection

story, how Jesus conquers death like he is life. Yeah. And just going on the on the darkness theme

as well. When light comes in, it just shines on everything. And it makes me think of truth as well,

just how light illuminates the truth, which then ties into the word. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I think

they cover it both a lot. But I think the big thing for me in terms of life is given that,

you know, Jesus more or less through coming through when he was born, I think that's the big part in

terms of terms of the the context of life, that light that's there, that hope, even within the

backdrop of what we saw last week, kind of like with how the babies were killed by Herod, there's

that hope that Jesus is shown there. And again, filter filter prophecy, but just for his resurrection

that he's there really bring eternal life to us. Thanks, guys. And then Rob, like he often does,

brought up three points for us to sort of reflect on and chew on throughout this week. He suggested

that God's gift to us, Jesus, is personal. It was his presence and it was pricey. So let's think a

little bit about personal gifts. We sometimes think about these being more relational. So they show

usually that we have this understanding of the other person. They're chosen specifically and

uniquely for that individual, not like a last minute gift card that we've probably all grabbed

off the shelf at one point or another for somebody or been the recipient of. So let's think a little

bit about how God's gift of Jesus at Christmas time is both for everyone, but also specifically

for you. What does that really mean to you guys? Like how do you think that's possible?

I mean, I think, I mean, obviously it definitely means both. Like Jesus is a gift to you,

like especially as believers and a gift to everyone, regardless of people who know that.

People maybe are in different faiths or maybe people are agnostics or atheists. Maybe they

don't realize it yet, but Jesus truly is a gift to everyone. And that for me resonates a lot.

I think the relational aspect of Jesus makes it so it's very specific to you because he knows

everyone's different on their faith journey. He knows how to make his presence known. For some

people who've known Jesus for a long time, there's something kind of familiar with how he comes up

in the Christmas season. Other people maybe knew the faith, like this might be the first time where

they experience the Holy Spirit in such a visceral way. So I think that's kind of the way where,

and I think where it's for everyone, I think that's a connection where as Christians, we

understand kind of the basis, like feeling of how God is within your journey. So while we all have

our individual journeys, we can still relate and kind of share our community with our faith in

Jesus, like as Christians. So I think that's how he's able to do both at the same time.

Mm hmm. I love that. Yeah.

Just the fact that Jesus came to earth, came to be human, just connects both the personal and the

fact that it's for everyone because Jesus came as a human to feel like all our personal feelings

and what it feels like to be human and just to save everyone to be there for everyone in the world.

Mm hmm. Yeah, it's true. It's wonderful. Thanks guys. Which one of these do you find easier to

grasp for yourself? Do you think that Jesus is a gift for everyone or that he's a gift for you?

I guess, I don't know, I'll say everyone. Just kind of like I mentioned before, like whether

people realize it or not, like they will realize it at one point in their lives or even beyond that.

So yeah, for everyone, for me. All right. Yeah, I would agree. I think it's easier for me to grasp

that Jesus is for everyone. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So presence was the next point that Rob brought up

for us. And as a gift, Jesus came to live and dwell among us and he used the word Emmanuel

and that actually means God with us. What are some ways that you, maybe personally,

or ways that you think that other people might long to experience Emmanuel, God with us?

I think especially for people who have gone through loss around time of Christmas or like

either in the past or even recently, you know, God can really provide that sense of comfort for them

knowing that, you know, there's someone with them that actually cares. And especially for those who,

you know, don't have many people with them during Christmas. I think that's a big part of it.

And I think that's where really we as Christians as a larger community also play a big role

in kind of acting almost as an extended family for those type of people. I love that point that we

are the hands and feet of Christ and that we can be that Emmanuel and God with us to those other

people. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I definitely think it's especially true in times of suffering that

you can really feel God's presence and that he's with you because we know like through Jesus,

God has experienced like all those depths of despair that all of humanity has experienced

at some point in their lives. So just knowing that he's there, he's been through it.

Mm hmm. That he understands. That's something we hear people say often. They just want someone to

understand me. I wish I was understood and that knowing that Jesus, like you said,

Jas, that he does know he's been there. Yeah. And so relational gifts take time, effort, energy.

They can be costly. And again, a lot of work, more work than a gift card right off the shelf.

Mm hmm. So in what ways, and Rob talked about it a little bit, is God's gift to us costly?

In what ways was it costly for him? Well, I think the big one that most of us are familiar with is

God sacrificed his life for us, right? Yeah. And when Jesus died on the cross, like,

I don't think anyone in this room would think only once about doing something like that. So

that, of course, was the biggest cost for him. Yeah. Yeah. That he paid that big price of his life.

Yeah. Yeah. I think you've been touching a bit on the sermon, how his incarnation, right, he took

on flesh. Being human is not easy. It's not like he chose an easy life either. The moment he was

born, he was trying to kill him. And then he had to stay in obscurity for almost like 20, 30 years

before he actually started his ministry. So it's not like he was born as a prince. He's not born as

anyone in power. He had a leisurely life. He worked like everybody else. And then when he

started his ministry, right, there's all this stuff that happened there. And even when he had his

closest people as disciples trying to hammer home the lessons, like, guys, you don't know what's

coming. You keep thinking something else is happening, right? It must be really tough for

him having the whole picture ahead of him and everyone else missing out what was actually coming.

And obviously you saw in the Garnet Gasset, even he was in like, you know, fully, like he was on

board, obviously, but he still struggled with the whole aspect of the sacrifice that Jorn was talking

about. So I think that's definitely a big part of it. Yeah, absolutely. And as we consider what it

means to give more and put relationships first in that giving, what excites you the most? I don't

know if you have any stories about things that you've done, maybe a gift that you've given,

or even thinking forward into the future. What makes you feel joy when you think about this type

of giving? Me, for me personally, I've given gifts like this before where my background is in graphic

design. So I've been able to like Photoshop certain things for people, like humorous things

and like memories that we've shared together. And it makes me happy knowing that like I'm about to

put a smile on someone's face to bring up that funny memory from the past or a joke, like an

inside joke or whatever. So it does give me more joy than giving someone like a gift card, which

is easier. But I think it's worth it to go the extra step in the more relational gift where we

have more in common in life. Well, that's great. You'll have to share one of those with the church.

So if you need a last minute gift, Jordan can Photoshop something for you.

Oh, that's fun. Yeah, I think just the thoughtfulness that goes behind these

types of gifts and the time spent on it, like even just if you're making a gift, let's say,

like you're knitting something. I don't know how to knit, but I wish.

There's still time. You and me both.

Just the time it takes to make that and like even thinking about the person as you're making that

gift for them just makes it extra special. Yeah, I think the biggest I mean for me is kind of the

surprise on the person's face, especially if you like really plan ahead of time. Usually if it's

tied more to an event or you're doing something specifically with them, it's their surprise that

comes from that. I think really, you know, it's home that you've done a good job.

Preferably like happy surprise, not bad surprise.

Right.

Right. Jesse drew me a Kermit face on one of my birthday cards and there's just an inside joke

about that and I just I howled like opening that card. So can we consider that to be a good

surprise? Oh, absolutely. Oh, so much better than a Hallmark card.

All right. So Jesse can draw you a card, everybody.

So we talked about what excites you most, but then we did talk about this being costly and pricey

in some way or another. So what about giving relationally do you think is the biggest

challenge for you? Because let's face it, not all of the gifts that we've given have had that

heartfelt, I guess, that meaning behind them. So what do you think is third of the biggest challenge?

Personally, I oh, no, no, you're the first. OK, I personally I was going to say a time.

Time is one of the most valuable resources on planet on the planet because we don't get it back.

So, you know, investing time to make a relational gift, I argue it's worth it, but it is it is

costly in that sense, especially as we find ourselves probably increasingly busy, at least

in society, right? Getting busier, more demands on our plates. Yeah, absolutely. It's kind of

tied to time, but it's kind of like it depends how long you know the person because it's almost like

it's almost like a lot of diminished returns. At some point you start running out of ideas.

And you're the better you give them the gift, the more you kind of feel like you have to one up

the what you've done already. So it's just a matter of like you want to show you've put enough effort,

but the same for you're not sure what you can do that's quite different enough to make sure

you have the same level of impact. Right. So there's some uniqueness here. So not just time,

but there's a creativity factor. Yeah, that makes sense. Anything else? I agree with the time.

Just finding and setting aside the time to make something intentionally. Yeah. And I don't think

it necessarily has to be in making something like you said, for example, getting the Taylor Swift

tickets. I assume it wasn't just one ticket. No, it was two. Right. So they're spending time together

too. I think for me, other than those three different reasons that you suggested, also

sometimes worrying or a fear that it's not going to land in a good way or it might not turn out

great or I saw Sally's sweaters, but I, you know, I couldn't make something like that. So is it good

enough to give that person? And then I think sometimes we have to remember that it is the

meaning that if someone were to give something to you, it's more about the thought necessarily

than always about the actual outcome. It's like when your kid makes a macaroni necklace and you

put it on the fridge and you don't criticize the child for missing a macaroni noodle on the necklace.

You thank them for that because they thought about you and they made that gift. That's right. They

took the time to do that. No, it's very true. So thanks guys for those questions. And I just

want to, yeah, thank you for joining me. And I'm not sure if you've taken the time to go to the

website yet, but we do have some resources on, if you go to the Christmas tab and click Advent

Conspiracy, there are, I think there's five different sections of different types of relational gifts

that you can give this Christmas. Some take longer than others, some great ideas out there.

So if you still have some people on your last minute shopping list to give to, feel free to

take a look at that. And I'd encourage everyone else to as well here in Trinity. So I just want

to thank you. Merry Christmas. Merry Christmas.