A Grief Survival Guide for Your Darkest Days | Trinity Talks Podcast

Hello everyone and welcome to this week's episode

of Trinity Talks. My name is Kyla and I am joined

here by three folks from Trinity's congregation

and today we're going to dive into a topic that

is really important but I think also really challenging

for folks to talk about and that is around grief

and loss. You know when those really hard things

happen in our life. When someone that we love

passes away or when we enter into a new stage

of life or when, you know, our health changes,

whatever it is, there's all kinds of hard things

that people are dealing with and often a sense

of loss and grief that comes with that. But these

folks all know what that experience is like and

have had the pleasure of sort of walking with

other people through that. So I'm excited to

sort of. dive into this conversation and figure

out how do we support one another in the midst

of those really challenging moments. So thank

you all for joining me. You're welcome. Yeah,

so maybe we'll get started, do a little bit of

introductions. You can just say your name and

maybe a little bit about sort of what your experience

with grief or with working with others who are

grieving has sort of been like. So we'll start

over here. Okay. Hi, I'm Ruth Bleinek. I've been

part of Trinity for probably about 15 years in

total. Professionally, I was a nurse for many,

many years. Gray hair shows it. Everything from

critical care to mission hospitals, home care,

but finally with hospice care. Okay. Personally,

I've had several losses of family through death.

Parents decades ago. Sure. A brother, a nephew,

but most impactful. My husband, three and a half

years ago. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. Thank you for sharing.

Sorry for your loss. Thank you. Yeah. Do you

want to introduce yourself here? Sure. My name

is Melissa. And eight years ago, June 5th, 2018,

I lost my 19 -year -old son, Alex. Okay. It was

a sudden death. It was not an illness. It was

just a freak accident. He was in a coma for three

days and then he did pass away, unfortunately.

And, you know, it's taught me how normal death

is, unfortunately. Sure. It's not a club I want

to join, but since I'm here, I don't have a choice.

Because people say, I don't understand how you

do it. And it's like, well, the choice wasn't

there. Right. Yeah. But yeah. The cards you were

dealt. Yes. So, but I've met some amazing people

through it. I have to say one positive thing.

I've met some awesome people and got to be part

of some awesome things and help people like yourself.

Share the message that people aren't alone. Yeah,

yeah. Thank you. Thank you. Yeah. And then over

here. I'm Charles Ansell. I've been at Trinity

34 years. Okay. So I'm just part of the fixture

and furniture. Of those 34 years, 25 have been

in the caring ministry. Yeah. For the first 10

years, I led the prayer and healing ministry

with Gwen Eck. And then the last 15 years, I've

been a Stephen minister and a Stephen leader.

So I've had experience working alongside people

who were going through grief and hearing their

stories. sharing their pain yeah yeah yeah yeah

and so for folks who aren't familiar stephen

ministers or folks who accompany those who are

dealing with some sort of stress in their life

or some difficult challenges and often that involves

grief and loss not always but that's correct

yeah yeah i'll be giving a plug for them later

okay you know what and same because i did when

i first joined trinity i joined stephen ministries

and a very lovely lady walked with me And actually

her and I just spoke the other day. She remembered

my daughter. She checked in. It was a beautiful

experience and I really liked her. Yeah. Yeah.

So I say it's a great thing because we not only

talked about my son, we talked about my youngest

child who's the one turning 18 about, you know.

her being a teenager and her getting ready to

leave. So it was a great experience. So yeah,

I'll help them plug. That's awesome. Awesome.

Yeah. Okay. So maybe to sort of start us off,

what's one thing that you wish more folks sort

of understood about grief or maybe, you know,

a misunderstanding that you've sort of encountered?

Yeah. Do you want to start us off again, Ruth?

Sure. I would say the one thing is that grief,

whether it be a loss through death or a less

recognized one, something like miscarriage or

infertility or, as you said, your empty nest,

each grief is unique. And in hospice world, we

use the term for someone with a life -limiting

illness of individual. not patient or client,

to designate that each grief is an individual

process for not just the person who is dying,

although we say living life to the fullest until

your death. But also the family and loved ones

nearby. So it's an individual process. Yeah.

One story isn't the same as another. One size

does not fit all. Yeah, for sure. For sure. Yeah.

Anything you would want to sort of add to that?

Things people understood. Things I had to understand.

Death is normal. And I did not get a choice.

And, but the one other thing is I'm still Melissa.

Some people treat me like I'm about to burst

into flames. Or if I talk about Alex, it's like,

oh my gosh, she's going to be okay. And it's

like, yeah, like people have to understand he

was still my son. I still have three kids and

people will look at me and be like, I don't know

how you, well, do you think I was like this the

first day? Right. Sure. This is eight years later.

Yeah. And people often don't think that they

just think, oh, my gosh, because they're first

hearing about it. Sure. You know what? I've often

liken it to when you get pregnant and you get

used to it. You're like, OK, now I'm pregnant.

But then you have to tell your significant other

and he's freaking out. That's how I think, because

you're you get used to it, but you're hearing

it for the first time. Right. So people have

to understand that you're hearing it for the

first time. Right. Right. It's not, it's not

news to you. Yes. It's I'm not, I'm going to

be okay. If you say, Hey, how are you? Yeah.

Are you, are you good? Are you having a good

day? I'm not going to, you know, melt or burst

into flames or go crazy. Sure. Yeah. Yeah. It's

okay to bring that up. It's okay to talk. To

still treat me like I am Melissa. Yeah. Cause

I am. Yeah. Because. child loss is not my personality.

I'm Melissa first. And people don't really see

that often. Yeah, no, that's totally fair. Yeah,

Naomi makes a great point. In our North American

culture, we're uncomfortable with grief, with

death, anything around it. And yes, we treat

people who are going through that, oh, you know.

We've got to be very careful with them and what

have you. Yes, you have to be sensitive. You

have to be caring. But they're still a human

being. They want support. They want care. And,

yeah, they want to know that they're heard. You've

got to listen to where they're at. And, yeah,

it's quite normal to talk about the person they've

lost. I lost both of my parents. I never got

to their funerals. My father died in England

while I was here in Canada, and my mom in New

Zealand. Okay. Now, for my mother, we had a celebration

of life here in Canada because she'd been here

a few times and some people knew her. Sure. And

I found it very comforting talking to people

because they had memories of my mother. Sure.

And, you know, yes, it's still painful. Yeah.

It's still a huge loss. But I just found some

comfort talking about the one I'd lost. Yeah.

You know, yeah, we've got to get over that, but

we've got to be sensitive. And, you know, there's

a right time and there's wrong time. So you've

got to listen and then, you know, respond to

the person, you know, the bereaved person. Wonderful.

On this point, loss, you know, yes, we think

of. you know, the loss of a loved one. But there's

many other sorts of loss that equally, you know,

it may not be as life changing, but job loss,

for example, you know, miscarriage, divorce,

life threatening illnesses, or spiritual crisis,

even, you know, or depression. I mean, these

are all people are grieving a loss of their normality

yeah and i think a shift in their identity often

as well i think is a really big piece of it right

like when it's yeah whether it is the loss of

a child the loss of a parent the loss of a job

the loss of a spouse like whatever it is if It

changes how you think of yourself, I think, right?

Yes. Like, I've been a mother for almost 30 years.

Yeah. And now that my baby's leaving, I'm like,

I don't know what to do. Sure. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Because my life is changing. Not that I won't

be a mother still, but it's not going to be in

the same way as when you've got minors. Yeah.

You know, in the house. Yeah. You know, she wants

to go away to university. I support her. Yeah.

But I'm still going to be alone. Yeah. It's still

going to change my life. For sure. For sure.

So. Yeah. Yeah. So on that note, like what would

you say are some of the most challenging aspects

of dealing with grief? Some of those maybe unexpected

pieces. Missing him. Yeah. The missing. Yeah.

You have no idea what I miss you means until

you have to miss someone. Yeah. You have no idea.

Yeah. And I hold to that because I didn't. I

thought this was something that happened to people

on TV. Sure. Not to me. And I didn't know. And

it's not just missing him, it's missing, he could

have had kids. He would have been 27. Yeah. So

he could have had children. Right. He could have

got married at 27, graduated university. Sure.

I could have been a grandma. Yeah. Yeah. So I

grieve those things. Recently, one of his friends

got married. I cried at that. Sure. You know,

so things he could have done. Yeah, yeah, yeah,

yeah. For sure. For sure. So that's the, I think

that's the biggest for me. I don't know about

others. Yeah. I would say that, you know, Kubler

-Loss says there's five stages of grief and others

have said seven. Sure. And so it's remembering

that grief is not a linear process. Yes. You

don't go from denial to anger, jump to acceptance

and away you go. That would be great. It's two

steps forward and one step back or sometimes

three steps back. Yes. Sure. Absolutely. accepting

that that's going to be the process. The other

thing I would say is that there's a lot of emphasis

put on that first year after the loss through

death. And in my case, now that I'm a widow,

and that's a new identity. Yes, for sure. I don't

have any family within hours from here. So everything

was on me to do financial, Practical. Yeah. And

so there's all of that to do the first year.

Yeah. And then after the first year, the adrenaline

goes down, the reality hits. Yep. And your group

of support is diminished. Yes. Because they've

moved on. Yeah. Yep. And you're still, you're

moving forward. Sure. But you never move on because

that person is always with you. Yeah. Yeah, yeah,

yeah. Sure. Yeah. Yeah. That's one of the hardest

things. Yeah. You've got to be patient with people

who are grieving, okay? Because, you know, there's

something called grief brain. Okay. Because,

you know, they're focusing. focusing so much

on their loss and the pain they're not sleeping

well there are physical symptoms they have but

also they're very forgetful they have difficulty

even doing routine sure household things you

know it means certainly they'll forget to pay

bills and things like that i had to be reminded

to eat sometimes yeah yeah yeah that's right

so you know if you're there trying to support

someone like that. You've got to be aware of

that. Don't underestimate, you know, the importance

of practical help. Sure. Just mundane things,

you know, the household chores, outside chores,

child care, transportation. Technical. Oh, tech

support. Yes. Technical. Charles is my... I appreciated

all the food being dropped off. That was awesome.

My neighbors really helped out. Yeah. Yeah. I

live in a great neighborhood, too. Yeah. Yeah.

I've got to get my bugaboo out of the way. Sure.

You've got to listen to the person. And, you

know, when we engage, you know, someone like

Naomi, right, who has lost her son, what do you

say? You feel you've got to say something. And

what you end up doing, you know, is saying platitudes

and cliches. Yeah. Which you think are helpful,

but they're not. In fact, they're hurtful, you

know, because they're showing, you know, you're

not listening. You don't understand. You can't

make assumptions like that. So, you know, you

don't say, oh, how are you doing? A person going

through grief, they don't know how they're doing.

Sure. How do you think I'm doing? I'm falling

apart, you know? Yeah. So it's a silly question.

But, you know, you can say, look. I am sorry

that you're going through this. I'm sorry for

your loss. Tell me, what's going on in your life

at the moment? Sure. I'm sorry for your loss

is often enough. I'm sorry for your loss. Yeah.

Yeah, so just the platitudes to avoid. Come on.

I know how you feel. No, you don't. Yeah, that

one, my goodness, if you really knew. Yeah. Oh,

it's for the best. They're in a better place.

God needed a flower for his garden. I heard that

one. God needed an angel or a flower for his

garden. Yep. It's God's will. God doesn't give

you more than you can handle. Or time heals all

wounds. Right. They sort of sound good. They're

not helpful. No. Okay. So just say you're sorry

and listen. Yeah. Yeah. For sure. For sure. Yeah.

So thinking about that and like, you know, these

are the unhelpful things to say. And some of

the things around faith specifically. Right.

Yeah. I think in a Christian context, we. should

know how to deal with grief well but i think

we don't always um but are there ways that you

think your faith has been impacted by your own

sort of grief and loss or by working through

that with other people i stopped believing in

god completely sure i lost my faith i i had no

i begged uh in the church at the hospital yeah

and i got told no And I was just, my son fell

eight feet and hit his head and died. Eight feet?

He should have just broke his leg. Like, sure.

You know, but I said, okay, God, me and you are

finished. Sure. I was done. Yeah. I was done.

Yeah. And then in 2023, well, okay, no, a little

bit before that, I went through some things and

my son had a Bible. And I found it on May 27th.

And in the Bible, another pastor from another

church had written May 27th to Alexander. And

I'm like, okay, yeah, I hear you. So I took his

Bible and that's what started my journey again.

And then I got here and it was Rob who said,

God doesn't stop cancer or child loss. That's

what started my journey at Trinity. I'm like,

finally, finally. Somebody says it. Somebody

of faith said it. It's God doesn't stop that.

It's going to happen. And Rob kept it real. So

I've always been grateful for that. Yeah, yeah,

yeah. I think what I was going to say really

fits with that because the Old Testament theologian

Walter Brueggemann, and my husband would be thrilled

I put a plug in for a theologian, compares the

Christian faith to... The Psalms of Lament, where

there's orientation, then disorientation, and

then a reorientation. And I would say that has

been my experience too. I didn't lose my faith,

but there was... when all I could say was help.

Like Annie Lamont says, help, thanks, wow. And

so I would say that my faith is deeper. And I

come back to that old hymn, in the valley he

restores my soul. Sure. And that's been my experience.

You were nodding, Charles. Were you going to

quote Bergerman too? No, no, no, no. I'm not

at that level. But yeah, I mean, in the early

stages of loss, the why question dominates. Why?

Why is this happening? Why is this happening

to me? You know, Naomi, you fell eight feet.

I'm sorry. I'm sorry. Yeah, his son fell eight

feet. He could have just broken a limb, as you

say. It could have ended so differently. You

go through all the what -ifs, and it just eats

away at you, and it eats away at your beliefs

and what have you. It can be very difficult.

What I've seen is God meeting people where they

are, in their pain, in their anger, in their

just... Absolute helplessness. Yes. You know,

I've seen God be present for them and in many

other expected ways. And I've come to see as

people go through their journey of loss and whatever,

they come to see that, oh, yes, you know, I had

some of the footprints. You know, the pouring

footprints. Yes. There's only one set of tracks

on the beach, you know. And those were the times

when I was going through the most hurt. And we

say, where were you, Jesus, during those periods

of my life when I was hurting? And Jesus just

says, those are the times I carried you. And,

you know, once people realize that, they can

come out at the other end stronger in their faith.

Yes. Sure. Yeah. Yeah. I think that's definitely

true. I think it's also important to, like, take

the long view in that. Yes. Right? Absolutely.

Like, I appreciate, like, the honesty that both

of you have had in sharing that, like, it gets

better, but it gets real bad first. Oh, absolutely.

Absolutely. I have to say God came to hell. and

met me there yeah because that's where i was

yeah i i don't know how real i can keep it i

almost ended my life yeah and jesus met me there

and i'm here yeah because of that right yeah

you know and it was a real factor for a lot of

days i didn't handle it right sure because there's

no like instruction manual just like when you

have kids there's no instruction manual yeah

so but it it But having good family, his funeral,

my sister's wife, Rachel, I have to give her

a shout out. She stepped in and planned Alex's

funeral. Yeah. And without being asked, without

it being a question, she just kind of stepped

in. Yeah. Yeah. So I think those kind of things

help keep me people around too. Yeah, yeah, yeah,

for sure. That helps build you back up when you're

lost. Yeah. You know, God sends people to help.

Yeah. That's what I think. Yeah, for sure. For

sure. Yeah. And I think just that sense that

like we can be, yeah, what feels like in the

pits of hell, in the darkness, in that place

where it feels like there is no hope and to know

as like cliche as it sounds, that God is still

there. Yes. And maybe I don't. Say that in those

words to you in that moment, because that may

or may not be helpful. But like to just know

as if I'm sort of supporting someone through

loss and grief to know that I can pray for that

person, that God is there. God has that. He's

already been ahead of you. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Because looking back now, I see I didn't even

plan Alex's funeral. It was Rachel. Yeah. And

I don't even remember it. And I. Thank God today,

I didn't have to. I didn't have to. God sent

someone to, because that's the first thing I

kind of remember that I had to live through.

And she was God sent to deal with that. So it

was beautiful. So thank you. Thank you for sharing.

This is a really important point. So if somebody

in the podcast is listening and you're going

through grief or a period of loss, I really want

you to know that you're not alone. You are not

alone. And that's so important to get your head

around that there is a God who cares and loves

you. And he is present whether you know it or

not. And also around you there are people who

do truly care and want to help. So don't shut

yourself off. Make yourself vulnerable and ask

for help. Yeah. It's going to help you. Yeah.

And sometimes you don't even have the energy

to ask. Yes. So that's when friends that are

our family. Perceptive. Yes. And show up. Yeah.

Show up. Yeah. My sister and Rachel live in BC.

And when they came here, I was like, I got to

be a kid sister, which was let my older sisters

handle it all. And they did. Yeah. I was like,

bye. And my younger sister as well, who's also

there for me, Stephanie. if I can call her at

any time she'd prefer I don't but I can sure

yeah so my and my best friend you keep like you

said your circle gets smaller so I have like

Tasha, Rachel, Farah, Stephanie yes I have my

parents and my brothers yeah but like you cherish

that for sure of that for sure I don't know what

I'd do without them yeah you know they're why

I'm here yeah for sure for sure Are there other

things that you think have been helpful for you

or for other people that you've seen as you sort

of walk through grief? So this having this circle

of support. Yes, I'd like to say surviving children

has helped. Yeah. Surviving children. I know

Jennifer Neville Lake, if you know who that is.

She was the girl who's she was the woman whose

children were killed by Marco Muzo, the drunk

driver. Oh, yes. Her three children and her dad.

Yes. She, in my darkest hours, was someone I

looked to. She lost all three of her children.

So knowing I had surviving children helped me.

I don't know about anybody else. What would you

add to that? The things that have been helpful.

Journaling. Reading both Christian and non -Christian

authors. The Bible, particularly the Psalms.

Some counseling. And as you said, friends, you

find out who's going to be with you after the

funeral. Yes. And there's a small circle, includes

Charles and Ruth, who have provided practical

and emotional support. Yes. Because with my family

so far away, not having parents, having one adult

son with special needs, I'm in a... Every situation

is unique. I know that. But it's been wonderful

to have friends. There's some extra bits to work

through. Complications. Yeah, for sure. And the

suddenness of my husband's death from an undiagnosed

medical condition. Right. He died at home in

our bed. And so, you know, all of a sudden, you're

confronted with planning a funeral. Unfortunately,

he was a pastor, and we had had enough deaths

that I was somewhat of an expert, although Charles

came through and helped me do the bulletins.

So those are the things that have been helpful.

Having a good planner is one of the greatest

things, I think. Someone who just steps in, okay,

here's what needs to be done. I like that part,

too. Yeah, one thing that has helped me when

I'm going through periods of loss or grief, um

is to force myself to think of one thing i've

been thankful for this day okay it seems a simple

thing sure but when you're in a dark place trust

me that's not easy but if you can force yourself

to do that yeah you know gratitude it it opens

up bright lights at the end of that tunnel for

you you know so you you know you may not be there

yet you're still in that dark place but you know

where you're going and the other thing as christians

is that we're people of the resurrection yeah

we have this hope yeah now you know you're in

a dark place and uh yeah you wonder where god

is how could i be in this place yeah but there's

still that glimmer of hope if you like that light

at the end of the tunnel yeah so if we can just

force ourselves to think of one thing yeah to

be thankful for yeah makes a difference yeah

it does absolutely being grateful thankful yeah

yeah and i think like christianity is a faith

of unreasonable hope yes right like that in those

dark places where it feels like we don't know

what's happening it feels like there's nothing

nothing to hold on to like yeah christianity

says there's still light yes jesus is still there

there's still something to find and like i know

for myself when i'm in some of those dark moments

it can feel really hard to find that light for

myself. But if there are people around me who

can say, no, like this is the thing to be thankful

for today. Or like, no, like I'm with you in

this and no, I'm going to bring you to church.

I'm going to bring you to like, we're going to

sit down and have coffee together. Like create

those spaces of life. Yes. Right. Being present.

Yeah. It's such, such an important thing. Yes.

Yeah. Yeah. I, I like when I'm feeling a way

and I can call my sister and she's like, really

and i'm like okay it's silly okay great and she

says things sometimes a little meaner but i need

that because sometimes you're you know going

off the rails and she's like she puts it back

sure and she'll put it back with laughter with

teasing yeah and yeah i'm like oh okay all right

so i am being a little you know yeah a little

extra as my kids would say yeah yeah so i'm grateful

for that just and laughing yeah because she'll

be like and then say a joke yeah you know jokes

i probably can't say on here sure whatever whatever

works but laughter sometimes is just It's awesome.

Yeah. So for folks who are sort of listening

to this conversation right now, if they are dealing

with grief and loss, like what is sort of one

thing that you might say to them, one thing that

you might sort of offer them? I would say be

kind to yourself. Practice self -care, whatever

that looks like for you. Sure. And don't, you

know, leave the shoulda, coulda, wouldas. Yeah.

Because that's not helpful. Sure. Yeah. No. And

as you said, Charles, be vulnerable. Allow people

in. There'll be bad days when you really don't

want to. You want to just close the curtains,

turn out the lights, and turn into a fetal position.

Yeah. But it's better to, if you can, reach out.

Yeah. And I would say. Be kind to yourself. Yeah,

yes. And seek the supports that you need, whether

they're professional or personal. Yeah, yes.

And practical. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I've been really

grateful for the people here who have given me

the names of an accountant and of a lawyer and

all of that. because mine were all retiring right

bless their hearts yeah yeah yeah yes yeah and

i think that like being kind to yourself that

like self -care sometimes like sounds a little

cliche and sometimes i think we complicate it

we're like uh self -care means like a spa day

or whatever but no sometimes self -care means

ordering some uber eats and just like having

a meal that you don't need to cook right like

it doesn't need to be I like to read, so I've

gone to the library and got a whole pizza and

called it a day. There you go. I think counseling

is important. People love you and care about

you, but I don't know how this is going to sound.

It might sound mean. You cannot lean on everyone

all the time. Sure. If you have access to benefits.

use them and I use mine for everything I get

a massage when I need it I get counseling when

I need it I think chiropractor I have never taken

advantage of my benefits like since I lost Alex

and people and I don't want people to think oh

no I can't share my story but there's something

to be said for a professional sure someone who

does not know alex so is or your loved one and

doesn't isn't gonna fall into the trenches with

you sure they're there to take you out i know

my sisters and then love and them love me but

they know alex yeah so i make space for their

grief too sure yeah so i i enjoy professional

and i know not all people have access to sure

sure but there are a lot of free services like

heart house hospice steven ministries that you

can take advantage of and i really think it was

nice with steven ministries she didn't know al

she didn't know me She was just there as a neutral

party. And that's what you need sometimes. Yeah,

for sure. Yeah, I just want to build on Ruth's

point because it's so important. You know, go

easy on yourself. You may be having a bad day.

Okay, you know, write this one off. Just, you

know, whatever you need. If you need to curl

up on the couch, if you need to just binge some

TV or whatever. look do it okay tomorrow may

be a better day and as you go along the number

of good days begin to outnumber the bad days

yes you know and you you begin to heal and move

and be able to function again sure but if you're

in that space don't you know, overly fight it.

Sometimes it's good to just give in and just

say, I need to rest. I need to get just the sleep

today. Sure. Yes. Do it. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's

like a wave. It's going to crash anyways. Yeah.

Yeah. Um, and do you want to share a little bit

more about Stephen ministry and how that works?

All right. Yes. Well, here at Trinity, we, we,

we've always had caring ministries and, um, So

we have Stephen Ministry. So these are trained

members of Trinity who are there to just walk

alongside you to provide one -on -one Christian

care in a completely confidential manner. So,

you know, yeah, if you need someone, as you said,

a neutral party in your life, who's not family,

there's no baggage or whatever, someone who's

just there to listen. and to support you and

to care and be consistent, a Stephen Minister

might be able to help you. We also have grief

books. Yeah, I don't know. You probably can't

see that, but there are four books that we send

out during the first year of loss. These are

really quite helpful, and they help you. Each

book deals with the particular... stage that

you may be at and help you work through and think

through some of the the things um so they're

sent out by uh steven minister bob degrass he

looks after it for us each booklet has a personal

letter attached as well so there's a a personal

touch i can speak to that and it was very meaningful

yeah it's beautiful yeah um there's the meal

train which provides meals for people or for

families that are just going through something

where it is difficult to just think about everyday

things like preparing meals and what have you.

So there is that. And also our prayer team as

well. Don't forget there's a team of people who

are committed and willing to pray for you if

you're willing to just share what your need is.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And so if folks are listening

and sort of thinking, well, some of those things

might sound helpful for me, I just encourage

you, you can reach out to the church. You can

give us a call. Or if you email care, C -A -R

-E, at trinitystreetsville .org, then you can

get a direct connection. Just say, hey, I heard

about Stephen Ministry or grief support or meal

train, whatever it is that you need. There's

lots of support available for folks. And take

advantage of it. Don't be shy. I had to learn.

not people who are doing this want to yeah um

and they want to help support you even the meal

train some days i'm lucky for my neighbors or

we would have survived on cereal sure you know

yeah yeah yeah yeah so neighbors make vegetables

and stuff and prepare actual meals that are good

for you so i that's great yeah that you got that

trinity offers that yeah So maybe you just sort

of end us off. We've talked a lot about the folks

who are going through grief and loss. But for

folks who are listening and they want to care

for or support people who are experiencing grief

and loss, what might you say to them? Do you

have any tips or advice you might offer? The

person who's grieving is normal. Okay. They're

the same person. I mean, I'm still Melissa. I

don't want to be treated like a grieving mother.

Yeah. Especially if you're going to be around

me all the time. Aren't you going to get tired

of that? Treat me like that. Treat me like I'm

so fragile. I think Charles said it well. It's

be present. Show up. Shut up. Share, but don't

compare. Oh, yes. Oh, so your son's father died

suddenly. My grandmother died. Yeah. Not helpful.

No. Not helpful. Your grandmother was 95. Right.

Yep. You know, one of the things I have found.

where I've had to bite my tongue till it bled

sometimes. And sometimes I haven't, which I probably

should have. Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, but I like

that. Share, but don't compare, right? Yeah.

Yes, yes. And just be there. And as I said, in

the early stages, as a person who's right in

the midst of mourning, they may not have the

energy to identify what it is they need. As you

said, showing up with a meal. Yeah. Someone took

my son out for a few hours one afternoon. My

sister and brother -in -law came and just stayed.

My brother and sister -in -law, I said my sister

and brother -in -law, and my brother and sister

-in -law also came. So I had that support. Yeah,

if you want to help someone, Right? Don't go

in with the attitude, oh, I can fix this. Right.

Right? Okay. You know, he can't make people a

special project. That's not how care works. You've

got to listen. You've got to be patient. Understand

what your limitations are. You're not going to

cure this situation. You wish, you really wish

you could make it better for them, that they

would have better days, that they wouldn't feel

the pain they're going through. But they've got

to go through it. But you can be there with them

and walk with them. You can care, but you can't

cure. Yeah, my niece Naya with my youngest who

became very introverted when she lost her brother

would just not talk and just they'd color. Yeah,

sure. That's it. And my youngest remembers that

about my niece Naya who would just sit in silence.

Yeah. That's it. Yep. And actually my youngest

was like, I really like when Naya did that. Yeah.

So sometimes nothing, just coloring or watching

TV with the person. Just being the presence of

another person in the space. Not talking, they

were just coloring and Ash appreciated it, which

I thought was nice too. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And

I think the other thing that I would maybe just

sort of add to that is like, as someone who is

caring for someone going through grief and loss.

sometimes you also had a sort of personal connection

to that person sometimes you didn't but just

sort of making sure that you're figuring out

how to best care for yourself in that space as

well yeah um and you know not taking on more

than you can handle and making sure that you

have space apart from that person to debrief

how you're feeling about all of that. Right.

But I don't want to support you through your

grief and then say, Oh, and now help me process

all of the things I'm feeling as well. Right.

I believe both of my sisters have counselors

of their own. Yeah. Um, to not only help themselves,

but to help me because they have a connection

to my son. They were the closest. We were a very

close family, and to lose Alex was like losing

a whole puzzle piece. Now our puzzle's incomplete.

So you need counseling too. Yeah. You know, if

you over -identify with the person you're trying

to help, if you imagine they're in a hole and

you're trying to pull them up, you can get pulled

in the hole as well. The key is to have empathy,

where, yes, you are listening, you are sensitive

to the people. people's needs uh you know what

they're going through but you're able to maintain

your own space and your own identity that's so

important as a caregiver because this is the

long haul people think oh three months what you're

not over it yet you know i mean they've moved

on with their lives you know i mean look You

know, there's a whole year of anniversaries,

of milestones, of, you know, family celebrations

where this person is not going to be there. That's

what got me was the things that he would miss,

like getting married, having kids. Yeah. Yeah.

So, you know, think about 18 to 24 months. Sure.

And, you know, yeah. It's a long time. That's

a long time. That's a commitment. So, you know.

be available, be consistent and be honest and

just say, look, you know, I've got to take a

break. Okay. Fair enough. It's better than being

inconsistent. Yes, for sure. For sure. Yeah.

Well, thank you so much, folks. I really appreciate

your honesty and your vulnerability and just.

Yeah, the ways that you have been willing to

share your lives. And I hope that folks who are

listening have been encouraged by that, that

folks have been able to find a little shed of

light, a little bit of hope. and support for

whatever they are experiencing. And thank you

for tuning in to this week's episode of Trinity

Talks. As I said, I hope you have found some

light and some hope in this. If you are in need

of support and we can help in any way, like I

said, email us, care at trinitystreetsville .org.

And whatever grief and loss you are facing right

now, I just pray that God fills you with a spirit

of hope, peace, and life, even in the midst of

that darkness. And we'll see you again next week.